Days Gone

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JinCA no.

First of all, you can't possibly put stock into what the GI guys said considering they struck a deal with Sony to feature Days Gone in this month's issue/website. Now isn't the time for them to speak critically about their experience.

Secondly, the "bland mission design" is particularly damning for two reasons. One, it shows that the people designing the missions suck. And two, the missions are most likely set in stone at this point. You don't drastically change mission structure this late into development.

This thing has stink all over it.

Negative previews are damning man. This game will be lucky to score in the upper 70s on metacritic. Just watch.

While there is no guarantee that the issues that this one person has with the game will be addressed it's also silly to take what he says as "damning" nearly a year before release. If they have hands on impressions in February next year that say the same thing then yeah there could be a problem but I'm willing to bet that just about any open world game is going to seem like a mess when it's still this far from release.
 
JinCA no.

First of all, you can't possibly put stock into what the GI guys said considering they struck a deal with Sony to feature Days Gone in this month's issue/website. Now isn't the time for them to speak critically about their experience.

Secondly, the "bland mission design" is particularly damning for two reasons. One, it shows that the people designing the missions suck. And two, the missions are most likely set in stone at this point. You don't drastically change mission structure this late into development.

This thing has stink all over it.

Negative previews are damning man. This game will be lucky to score in the upper 70s on metacritic. Just watch.
I never agree with you, and I never want to. But I have to agree with you on this. I just hope we are wrong when it finally comes out. It's not looking too hot right now.
 
This game will be lucky to score in the upper 70s on metacritic.

If I had to guess now, I'd put it about 5 points higher than that, low 80s.

To me, that's fine. If you look at Bend's games previous to this, very few of them were showered in critical praise (some were). However, most of them did fine in the reviews and sold reasonably well.

That's probably a realistic expectation here, too. It's not going to be a 90+ masterpiece. It's not going to be GoTY material. It's not going to be a dumpster fire, either. It's going to get above average scores (low 80s is above average), but not anything terribly impressive. There will be some unusually negative reviews mixed in there, along with some very positive ones.

In other words, it will be like a lot of other games.

Sales are a different question. If I were to guess, I'd say it'll sell good not great, enough to warrant a sequel. But who knows. We're all equally good at predicting the future, which is to say, not very good at all.
 
If I had to guess now, I'd put it about 5 points higher than that, low 80s.

To me, that's fine. If you look at Bend's games previous to this, very few of them were showered in critical praise (some were). However, most of them did fine in the reviews and sold reasonably well.

That's probably a realistic expectation here, too. It's not going to be a 90+ masterpiece. It's not going to be GoTY material. It's going to get above average scores (low 80s is above average), but not anything terribly impressive. There will be some unusually negative reviews mixed in there, along with some very positive ones.

In other words, it will be like a lot of other games.

Sales are a different question. If I were to guess, I'd say it'll sell good not great, enough to warrant a sequel. But who knows. We're all equally good at predicting the future, which is to say, not very good at all.
I dont think I have ever played a bend game.
 
I dont think I have ever played a bend game.

Never owned a PS1?

Long before Halo, there was Syphon Filter... Gabe Logan and his full-diaper running animation. You missed out, man. lol
 
Never owned a PS1?

Long before Halo, there was Syphon Filter... Gabe Logan and his full-diaper running animation. You missed out, man. lol
No, never owned a PS1 :(. I know, I missed out. I had a time where there were years when I didn't game. Mostly when I was in the Army and college. Never even crossed my mind really. Just partied, school, got laid and traveled with my unit. I have heard of Syphon Filter though.
 
No, never owned a PS1 :(. I know, I missed out. I had a time where there were years when I didn't game. Mostly when I was in the Army and college. Never even crossed my mind really. Just partied, school, got laid and traveled with my unit. I have heard of Syphon Filter though.

While you were serving the military and getting an education, I was stoned in Walmart, buying a $99 PS1. That was 1999. I'd never owned a videogame console before. I figured, "For 99 bucks, what the hell."

I played a bunch of PS1 games, but I didn't like most of them (FF, MGS, all the big franchises, I couldn't get into any of them). I really liked Syphon Filter, though -- it was one of the few PS1 games I really enjoyed. So I've got some gratitude and affection for Bend studios. Without them and Syphon Filter, I might not have gotten interested enough in gaming to read more about it online and discover there was this new thing coming out in about six months, called the Xbox, then join this fledgling forum called MSXbox (I think that's what it was called?).
 
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While you were serving the military and getting an education, I was stoned in Walmart, buying a $99 PS1. That was 1999. I'd never owned a videogame console before. I figured, "For 99 bucks, what the hell."

I played a bunch of PS1 games, but I didn't like most of them (FF, MGS, all the big franchises, I couldn't get into any of them). I really liked Syphon Filter, though -- it was one of the few PS1 games I really enjoyed. So I've got some gratitude and affection for Bend studios. Without them and Syphon Filter, I might not have gotten interested enough in gaming to read more about it online and discover there was this new thing coming out in about six months, called the Xbox, then join this fledgling forum called MSXbox (I think that's what it was called?).

And I have never been stoned either. I told my wife I want to try it sometime. She said she has tried it, and found it to be nothing, so she didn't do it again. Maybe one day I will try it to say I tried it as a bucket list accomplishment :)

I will look more into this Bend game as it gets closer. I have been enjoying your taste in games more and more as I see you post about them when they are indie or unique, so I may trust your judgement again on this one.
 
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I will look more into this Bend game as it gets closer. I have been enjoying your taste in games more and more as I see you post about them when they are indie or unique, so I may trust your judgement again on this one.

Oh well, thanks for the kind words, but I wouldn't want anyone to trust my judgment. Trust your own judgment. You know your taste better than I do. And there's plenty of areas where our game tastes diverge.

This may go without saying, but when I express positive thoughts about a game, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I'm just expressing my thoughts/feelings, maybe providing fuel for discussion for anyone interested. I'm not trying to sell anyone on the game (although maybe it appears that way?). I have no clue if others will enjoy what I enjoy. Odds are, they probably won't (because my taste diverges from so many other people's taste).

But I'm not trying to persuade people that the game is for them (that goes for any game I talk positively about). That's all very subjective and always comes down to personal taste.
 
Oh well, thanks for the kind words, but I wouldn't want anyone to trust my judgment. Trust your own judgment. You know your taste better than I do. And there's plenty of areas where our game tastes diverge.

This may go without saying, but when I express positive thoughts about a game, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I'm just expressing my thoughts/feelings, maybe providing fuel for discussion for anyone interested. I'm not trying to sell anyone on the game (although maybe it appears that way?). I have no clue if others will enjoy what I enjoy. Odds are, they probably won't (because my taste diverges from so many other people's taste).

But I'm not trying to persuade people that the game is for them (that goes for any game I talk positively about). That's all very subjective and always comes down to personal taste.
Well your judgement alone wouldn't sway me :)
 
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Another mixed reaction preview, this one from Gamespot:


PS4 Zombie Game Days Gone Has An Impressive Open World, But Could Use More Original Ideas

Coming from Bend Studio, the same developers behind the Syphon Filterseries and Uncharted: Golden Abyss, the upcoming open-world game is a massive departure for its creators, which shows some solid signs of ambition.

[....] I enjoyed the way Days Gone presents its world, but I couldn't get over how familiar it all felt. With the fantasy of the zombie apocalypse being a very common premise--survivors being pushed to their limits while dealing with life in a chaotic post-civilization where bandits and the undead are out to kill you--it was hard to find something really unique in Days Gone. It often traversed a very well-worn path in the hour I spent with the game....

Days Gone shows a lot of potential when it comes to offering a large world to explore. ... Even though it was a brief demo that only scratched the surface of what we can expect in the final game, I was impressed with how much of content and sights there are to see.


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But we still have some concerns about whether it can find a more meaningful way to distinguish itself apart from some cool moments riding the motorcycle and the amazingly detailed zombie swarms. With a release coming sometime in early 2019, there's some time for Days Gone to get itself into shape on the technical side of things, and hopefully show us a stronger sense of identity.

More here:
https://www.gamespot.com/articles/ps4-zombie-game-days-gone-has-an-impressive-open-w/1100-6459096/

 
Kind of reminds me of the red flags that The Order had before release. But I enjoyed that game. I'm sure this will be fine.
 
The game isn't coming out until sometime in 2019. They've got time to clean it up.
 
They do have time to address the technical glitches (which are expected), but the issues about "we've seen this before" can't really be addressed in 10 months. It's a complaint we've heard many times since the initial E3 showing, a year ago. It's going to continue coming up.

Thinking back on Syphon Filter, I realize that game, even though I enjoyed it, was nothing terribly original or ground-breaking. It was a game about a secret agent who shot bad guys. Wow, never heard that one before!

I'm thinking maybe Sony Bend isn't a team that is really interested in, or talented at, being creative and original or breaking new ground. Apart from Syphon Filter sequels, they've worked on doing Vita sequels to Uncharted. Some have been very good, but you couldn't call them original.

You can see hints of that in the GI interviews. The developers don't give off, say, a Neil Druckman vibe -- taking the medium super-seriously and wanting to push it forward into interesting new areas. They seem like a bunch of fairly ordinary guys who want to create a game that they would find interesting -- a game they think would be cool and fun to play. They are open about the TV series, books, and games that they're taking their cues from. So maybe originality isn't strong in their DNA.

It doesn't mean the game will be boring. It could be quite fun, at least for people who aren't needing the game to break new ground and be terribly creative or original. That's why I made that other thread about whether a game needed to be original to be fun. I think we all value originality, creativity, boundary-pushing, etc. at different levels.

It'll be the same for reviewers. It might be more accentuated for reviewers, actually, because they spend lots of their lives playing videogames and probably get sick of overdone themes/settings faster than a normal gamer does.
 
https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/22/days-gone-hands-on-2018/

engadget going ham on Days Gone too.

This game is ****ed boys.

People will have Red Dead 2 fresh in their minds while playing this and the comparison won't be pretty.

To be far though, ANY game that comes out within lets say a 3 month window of RDR 2 is going to reviewed harshly. Especially if its in the same type of genre ( open world, action adventure) And unless the game itself is a masterpiece, its probably going to suffer.

However, just going off what I've seen, I think there's a market for Days Gone. It may not set sales records like God of War but I think it will do better than Knack or The Order.
 
I played a bunch of PS1 games, but I didn't like most of them (FF, MGS, all the big franchises, I couldn't get into any of them). I really liked Syphon Filter, though...

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Syphon Filter was the Nickelback to Metal Gear Solids Pearl Jam. We all knew this, even at a young age!
 
To be far though, ANY game that comes out within lets say a 3 month window of RDR 2 is going to reviewed harshly. Especially if its in the same type of genre ( open world, action adventure) And unless the game itself is a masterpiece, its probably going to suffer.

However, just going off what I've seen, I think there's a market for Days Gone. It may not set sales records like God of War but I think it will do better than Knack or The Order.

I agree.

Critical reception is one thing, sales are another. It'll probably a get fair to middling reviews (80-83?), but I think it'll do fine with regard to sales.

Hardcore enthusiast forum-goers and professional reviewers are often out of touch with what Joe Gamer enjoys, and PS4 has lots of Joe Gamers. I can't help but point out that Sunset's GOAT, Fortnite, is a good example of this -- you don't see much discussion of it on forums, and its metacritic is at the same level Sunset predicts for the doomed/f*cked Day Gone, 78. (Yes, I know they're different games, Sunset, so spare us the thesis on Fortnite's brilliance.)

My point is that metacritic averages are different than sales, and being "doomed" in one area doesn't mean you're doomed in the other.
 
Critical reception is one thing, sales are another. It'll probably a get fair to middling reviews (80-83?), but I think it'll do fine with regard to sales. Hardcore enthusiast forum-goers and professional reviewers are often out of touch with what Joe Gamer enjoys, and PS4 has lots of Joe Gamers. I can't help but point out that Sunset's GOAT, Fortnite, is a good example of this -- you don't see much discussion of it on forums, and its metacritic is at the same level Sunset predicts for the doomed and f*cked Day Gone (78 ). (Yes, I know they're different games, Sunset, so spare us the thesis on Fortnite's brilliance.)

My point is that metacritic averages are different than sales, and being "doomed" in one area doesn't mean you're doomed in the other.

What reason would there be to expect so much better than 80 anyway? They haven't made a console game in 15 years. 80 would be a bad result for TLOU 2 but probably fine for Days Gone.
 
I agree.

Critical reception is one thing, sales are another. It'll probably a get fair to middling reviews (80-83?), but I think it'll do fine with regard to sales.

Hardcore enthusiast forum-goers and professional reviewers are often out of touch with what Joe Gamer enjoys, and PS4 has lots of Joe Gamers. I can't help but point out that Sunset's GOAT, Fortnite, is a good example of this -- you don't see much discussion of it on forums, and its metacritic is at the same level Sunset predicts for the doomed/f*cked Day Gone, 78. (Yes, I know they're different games, Sunset, so spare us the thesis on Fortnite's brilliance.)

My point is that metacritic averages are different than sales, and being "doomed" in one area doesn't mean you're doomed in the other.

You're trying to say that the coorelation between Metascore and sales are non existent or weak.

In reality, publishers give financial incentives to developers based on their games Metascore. Why do they do this? Because publishers know there is a strong link between critical acclaim and sales.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/kotaku...-developer-bonuses-based-on-review-scores/amp

In fact, if you look at each months top 10 list (sales), you'll see the vast majority score favorably with critics. Not too many games that score in the 60s and 70s make it into the top 10.

Lastly, you try using Fortnites low metacritic score to support your argument when in reality, it works against it. Fortnites metascore is based on the Save the World campaign, not Battle Royale. By all accounts, Save the World didn't perform all that well commercially.

There are two things I know with relative certainty regarding Days Gone at this point.

One, it's not getting an 80+ for a Metascore. Games that score in the low to upper 80s generally recieve warmer impressions from previews. The criticisms we've seen thus far don't appear to be something that can be cleaned up in the next 9 months.

Two, the folks at Sony Bend are now officially sweating it until release. They can't be thrilled at seeing the response from critics and forums and they know Sony is watching. Jobs are on the line with this one folks.
 
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You're trying to say that the coorelation between Metascore and sales are non existent or weak.

No, that's not what I'm trying to say. I'm saying the correlation is modest -- until you reach metacritic scores above 90, anyhow.

That's not just my opinion. I'm taking my info from Mat P, an NPD analyst who posts on Resetera a lot. He has talked a number of times about this -- there is only a modest relationship between quality (as judged by metacritic scores) and sales. I think he said 30% (?).

There's a qualifier -- that is true for scores below 90. Once you get to metacritics above 90, the relationship strengthens. As an example, he said that a 2-point jump at 90+ (e.g., 92 vs. 94) could make a significant impact on sales ("impact" isn't the right word, since it connotes causality, but never mind that for a minute), whereas it would take a 10-point jump at below 90 (e.g., 75 vs. 85) to make the same degree of difference.

In reality, publishers give financial incentives to developers based on their games Metascore. Why do they do this? Because publishers know there is a strong link between critical acclaim and sales.

Not a "strong relationship;" a modest relationship. It doesn't have to be a strong relationship to make a difference. Even a modest correlation can make a significant difference in revenue, when you're talking about millions of sales.

So I'm not saying there's no relationship. I'm saying it's a modest one -- meaning they are two separate things and shouldn't be conflated, as if one means the other. There are plenty of games that review well and sell poorly and plenty of games that review averagely and sell fine.
 
Here's a good preview. Easy Allies seems pretty reliable. His one sentence summary: "Days Gone is great, and it's gonna be great." Although he does go on to say it's running at 15 fps, lol, so it's still rough around the edges.





Kinda Funny also liked it (cued up).

 
Eh, great preview. Gerstman didn't even play the game (because the kiosk was too crowded) -- just glanced at it a couple times as he was walking by and decided it was all about "a guy crawling in a dumpster." Very informative.

I don't really like Gerstman anyhow. He always sounds jaded, cynical, and negative. I doubt we have the same taste in games.
 
Eh, great preview. Gerstman didn't even play the game (because the kiosk was too crowded) -- just glanced at it a couple times as he was walking by and decided it was all about "a guy crawling in a dumpster." Very informative. He sounded jaded and cynical about it, which is how he sounds about nearly everything.

Patrick Klepeck was dogging it worse than Gerstman though. You're also ignoring the fact that Gerstman and Klepeck both made references to the fact that the people around them weren't impressed either.

Face it, this has BOMBA written all over it.