Multiplatform Graphics Discussion [OT]

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VFX_Veteran

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#1
All:

Several threads have gone off-topic on arguments based on graphics of various games.. I am guilty of doing this myself. So, I thought I would start a thread that encompasses any and all discussion of graphics on all platforms and across any game (exclusives included). Compare and do VS to your heart's content!
 

VFX_Veteran

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#2
Question: Why has our gaming community reverted to showing cutscenes and photomode to show off graphics in a game as opposed to the actual gameplay? This has become increasingly popular on various websites. Don't we all spend our time actually playing the game instead of watching a FMV or photomode? Cutscenes almost always look better than gameplay. So it's a bit deceiving IMO to show off a game's graphics by giving cutscenes. A game's graphics engine is best judged by how it handles when the gamer has complete control of the character and camera system.
 

DriedMangoes

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#4
How about you take regular screenshots like I do. You don't play the game in photomode..
Here are some Infamous screens I took back at its launch - gameplay as you requested.











Some more from photomode (just gameplay frozen in time with dof + angle user controlled)







These are from JinCA back from V1 pics thread



 

VFX_Veteran

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#5
Let's analyze some of these shots. Subjectively, I can't argue.. but I can point out some things missing that I wish were in this game.


The character is again not showing any indirect lighting. He's way too dark in shadow. He should be picking up environment lighting from the sky. Also notice the light sources aren't reflecting on the water. That's a good shot though.



Again.. cave is too dark..



Light sources in this lab room that don't cast shadows. Notice the book, film, paper, etc.. none of them have shadows.



Particles look nice since they are actual light sources.. but I wish they would cast shadows.







Reflections of light sources but not of the scene... I tried looking for real reflections (dynamic as well as static) and couldn't find any.
 

BDaddyK

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#6
BRB popcorns ready...
 

DriedMangoes

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#7
VFX_Veteran , Some more gameplay pics from other members on this forum. As you can see, the assets from these pics and photomode pics are the same. The difference is just the angle and dof.

















 
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DriedMangoes

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#8
Let's analyze some of these shots. Subjectively, I can't argue.. but I can point out some things missing that I wish were in this game.


The character is again not showing any indirect lighting. He's way too dark in shadow. He should be picking up environment lighting from the sky. Also notice the light sources aren't reflecting on the water. That's a good shot though.



Again.. cave is too dark..



Light sources in this lab room that don't cast shadows. Notice the book, film, paper, etc.. none of them have shadows.



Particles look nice since they are actual light sources.. but I wish they would cast shadows.







Reflections of light sources but not of the scene... I tried looking for real reflections (dynamic as well as static) and couldn't find any.
Sound analysis yet still the game is one of the top, if not the top-looking game out right now. Photomode or not.

Photomode just takes away more of the HUD and adds in the creative aspect from the user/gamer. The gameplay/visuals elements remain the same. So I don't know why you would take away from photomode when it is using the same assets as in realtime gameplay just frozen in time and in a certain perspective.

Besides, you were using Unity PC screenshots vs. Infamous PS4 screenshots in the other thread and still, Infamous held its own quite well I must say for an "underpowered" next-gen console. ;)
 

bullzeye

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#9
Unity does look amazing in it's own right, the enviroments and detailed characters are real standouts.
 

pravus

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#10
The main character (Delsin) looks pretty good and decently detailed, but not much else about the game.
 

DriedMangoes

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#12
The main character (Delsin) looks pretty good and decently detailed, but not much else about the game.
The environments are decent for an open world game. Remember this game was released 5 months after the system launched and SuckerPunch was able to get the game running at 1080p with an avg FPS of 35.







 
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DriedMangoes

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#13
Oh and VFX_Veteran , maybe put bandwith heavy in the thread title for those on mobile. :D
 

MW

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#15
BF4 still awes me.
 

pravus

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#16
The game is a mix-up of good and bad. Like those screens for instance, the lighting only looks good in certain scenarios (is it prebaked?).

Take note of this shot you posted:


Most objects cast shadow convincingly, but then look at the buildings. I mentioned this before the game came out as well when we were discussing the first shots of the game, the lighting is completely borked in some instances.

This shot demonstrates it as well:



The static non-lighting going on makes buildings look decidedly last-gen and it sticks out like a sore thumb. I'm guessing it's a LOD thing, but I mean it's not even almost far away in either of these shots that they should be dropping the lighting on objects.

Also, damn you guys and your 35-37fps stuff. Your tv isn't displaying those extra frames correctly and the frame timing is off and it's not a good thing IMO. Also if slightly more responsive controls are what you're getting out of that, then the developer could absolutely update that at a fast rate if they wanted to (without framerate being a determining factor); lots of racing games do this). IMO, the framerate, they need to lock that s***; I'm not sure why they didn't if the game doesn't frequently drop below 30fps.
 
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DriedMangoes

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#17
The game is a mix-up of good and bad. Like those screens for instance, the lighting only looks good in certain scenarios (is it prebaked?).

Take note of this shot you posted:


Most objects cast shadow convincingly, but then look at the buildings. I mentioned this before the game came out as well when we were discussing the first shots of the game, the lighting is completely borked in some instances.

This shot demonstrates it as well:



The static non-lighting going on makes buildings look decidedly last-gen and it sticks out like a sore thumb. I'm guessing it's a LOD thing, but I mean it's not even almost far away in either of these shots that they should be dropping the lighting on objects.

Also, damn you guys and your 35-37fps stuff. Your tv isn't displaying those extra frames correctly and the frame timing is off and it's not a good thing IMO. Also if slightly more responsive controls are what you're getting out of that, then the developer could absolutely update that at a fast rate if they wanted to (without framerate being a determining factor); lots of racing games do this). IMO, the framerate, they need to lock that s***; I'm not sure why they didn't if the game doesn't frequently drop below 30fps.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-vs-infamous-second-son

"As we noted in the initial performance analysis piece, Second Son utilises a physically-based renderer with a proper energy conservation model in play allowing light to interact with materials in a more natural and realistic way. Energy conservation plays an important role in a physically-based renderer in part by placing limits on the intensity of reflected light based on the value of the incoming light. The specular highlight of an object, for instance, cannot produce more light than the source light. The way sunlight reflects in pools of water or the way car headlights project into the world appear much more realistic than a more traditional model might offer. This approach to lighting combined with a heavy reliance on high-intensity spotlights are precisely what help create the sense of vibrancy present in the game."

"To ensure a high level of quality, Sucker Punch opted not to utilise a full real-time lighting system that tracks the time of day - instead the team concentrated on lighting the city across eight different set times, with the game switching between them according to the story or the mission."

Also, SP has implemented a 30FPS cap option shortly after launch for the user/gamer to enable if they want to. :D
 

pravus

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#19
That movie poster is absolutely ace.

Next round of versus, I wanna see Halo 4 TMCC v. Destiny.
 
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DriedMangoes

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#20
How about some Forza vs. DC? :p

Should be fair since both have photomodes enabled. Should make for some great shots.

Here are some DC photomode:

















 

JinCA

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#21

JinCA

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#22
Question: Why has our gaming community reverted to showing cutscenes and photomode to show off graphics in a game as opposed to the actual gameplay? This has become increasingly popular on various websites. Don't we all spend our time actually playing the game instead of watching a FMV or photomode? Cutscenes almost always look better than gameplay. So it's a bit deceiving IMO to show off a game's graphics by giving cutscenes. A game's graphics engine is best judged by how it handles when the gamer has complete control of the character and camera system.
Do you know what a photo mode is? you can take 100% pure raw gameplay pics if you choose to, yes you can change the depth of field if you'd like or put a filter on it etc but it's not forced. I personally like photo modes because you can change the camera angles as well as zooming in or out but adding effects isn't something that's done unless the person chooses to and even then it's limited. I will agree that think taking pics of cut scenes is cheating as it isn't always representative of what the game truly looks like.
 
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bullzeye

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#23
Some of those DC photos look ace, theres a whole thread of Horizon photos, both incredible looking games.

Here's a nice horizon pic

 
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Troublegum

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#27
Some of those DC photos look ace, theres a whole thread of Horizon photos, both incredible looking games.

Here's a nice horizon pic

The funniest thing about this picture is not that it is low poly but that the artists made sure the most detailed part of the model was the boobs!:grin:
 
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JinCA

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#28
Still crazy to me to see skin that looks that good up close on a character model.







 

starseeker

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#30
Well DC does looks better from these scenes. To be fair, FH2 is a cross gen game, open world & running on weaker hardware. Interested to see the next full (maybe) next gen FH3.

But credit where credit is due.
 
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