Numbers Discussion Thread

[Flynn]

How is not cherry picking, based on the accepted of cherry picking. It's picking just pockets of data to make it seem like XB1 is more popular in December than PS4.

That's just factually false. It's not a "popularity" measurement, it's a sales measurement, and Xbox One sold more than PS4. There's no explicit or implicit claim about one being more popular than the other, that's just your own flawed interpretation.

It's like me saying "PS4 was the fastest selling console in the month of December ..... in south africa"..

It's actually nothing like that. There's no side disclaimer. All the numbers are out in the open, and plain as day:

November sales:
X1 > PS4 (daily average)
X1 < PS4 (overall)

December sales:
X1 > PS4 (overall)
X1 > PS4 (daily average)

Cumulative sales:
X1 > PS4 (daily average)
X1 < PS4 (overall)

That is most likely factually correct, and every bit cherry picking.

Again, factually mistaken. Please point out the cherry picking in that list.

By the very definition of cherry picking, it is. You and I know PS4 sold fastest WW. People are picking one region to make the label "fastest selling" more favorable to XB1. Definition of cherry picking....to choose or take the best or most profitable of (a number of things),esp for one's own benefit or gain

This is simply false.

Today, NPD numbers came out. NPD deals with ONE region. The numbers are NOT WW numbers. Therefore, to bring up WW numbers in a discussion about NPD numbers is ultimately irrelevant. Besides, no one's denying PS4's the top selling console of 2013... but factually, plainly, and demonstrably - Xbox One sold more units in December than Sony did (per NPD), and therefore it's also maintained it's title for "fastest selling current gen console in NA".

 

[Intellivision]

Dayyyyum!

Looks like current gen is trending to next gen. X1 will have the best software sales and attach rate.

 

[Z A C K]

This thread is bad for my mental health.

I'll drink (heavily) to that.

 

[Intellivision]

Today, NPD numbers came out. NPD deals with ONE region. The numbers are NOT WW numbers. Therefore, to bring up WW numbers in a discussion about NPD numbers is ultimately irrelevant. Besides, no one's denying PS4's the top selling console of 2013... but factually, plainly, and demonstrably - Xbox One sold more units in December than Sony did (per NPD), and therefore it's also maintained it's title for "fastest selling current gen console in NA".

Qbert should get a job at Sony. I never knew NPD represented global sales. You learn something new every day. LOL

 

[Flynn]

Well, it's kind of a push me-I shove back kind of thing right? It takes two to tango. MS and MS fans say they were the fastest selling console based on average daily sales since launch and "we won NPD December!" and Sony and Sony fans have to one up them and say "but we are the best selling next-gen console of 2013!" So it's all good fun IMO.

Right, it's all good fun. It's really not a big deal... I'm just surprised Sony zealots are having such a hard time conceding any small victory for MS (and make no mistake, with a >1 deficit to Sony world-wide, being the fastest selling console in NA is a small victory), because it doesn't in any way diminish the fact that Sony's sold more world wide.

Why not just accept, and own both truths? Madly trying to diminish, belittle, or minimize one of those facts - let's just accept them. Easy enough for some of us... but clearly hard for others...

 

[DriedMangoes]

Looks like current gen is trending to next gen. X1 will have the best software sales and attach rate.

In US? Maybe. But the best software sales so far goes to Sony with 9.7 million software sales.

 

[TeKPhaN]

You mean in NA, correct?

If he did that would make no sense as the PS4 sold over one million in 24 hours in NA alone...the X1 didn't.
Its all pretty simple.

 

[Flynn]

You mean in NA, correct?

Again, the discussion is about NPD... so implicitly, yes of course in NA. NPD doesn't report on WW figures.

MODS - note for the future - it would really make more sense to keep some individual threads about these topics. We get some really good, measurable data from NPD, so it should really have it's own thread. It would make the discussion *FAR* easier, and much cleaner.

 

[Flynn]

What's

In US? Maybe. But the best software sales so far goes to Sony with 9.7 million software sales.

What's Microsoft's WW including digital?

 

[Intellivision]

If you want a shooter system, PS4 has you covered. You can ut those redesigned DS4 shooter triggers to good use. Even excluded from the list are Blacklight and Warframe for extra shooter fun.

creamsugar
Member
(Today, 04:18 AM)

ps4 ltd

cod
800k
600k
bf
550k
ac
500k
450k
2k14
kz
400k
25
300k
nfs
250k
14
200k
KNACK
150k
lego
100k

example: cod>800k, 150k>logo>100k

 

[Intellivision]

Ah well. Of to bed. Have fun posters. It's just video games guys. Titanfall and Infamous are the next big games coming out. Just have fun.

Interestingly, all the Sony execs have been quiet today. Not sure why.... (lol)

 

[Qbert]

That's just factually false. It's not a "popularity" measurement, it's a sales measurement, and Xbox One sold more than PS4. There's no explicit or implicit claim about one being more popular than the other, that's just your own flawed interpretation.



It's actually nothing like that. There's no side disclaimer. All the numbers are out in the open, and plain as day:

November sales:
X1 > PS4 (daily average)
X1 < PS4 (overall)

December sales:
X1 > PS4 (overall)
X1 > PS4 (daily average)

Cumulative sales:
X1 > PS4 (daily average)
X1 < PS4 (overall)



Again, factually mistaken. Please point out the cherry picking in that list.



This is simply false.

Today, NPD numbers came out. NPD deals with ONE region. The numbers are NOT WW numbers. Therefore, to bring up WW numbers in a discussion about NPD numbers is ultimately irrelevant. Besides, no one's denying PS4's the top selling console of 2013... but factually, plainly, and demonstrably - Xbox One sold more units in December than Sony did (per NPD), and therefore it's also maintained it's title for "fastest selling current gen console in NA".

Oh my god, you really don't know what cherry picking is, do you. Cherry picking is indeed taking FACTUAL statements to make someone look better than what it really is. Everything above is cherry picking.

Fact, from date of release, PS4 is the fastest selling console. Period. Taking snippets of time to make it appear as if XB1 was fastest selling is cherry picking. Yes, using those time periods are factual, and no one is saying it's false, but it's picking pockets of data for a hidden agenda.


Again, bottom line, PS4 is fastest selling. Using the same metrics that MS fans like to use for Nov.... PS4 in 2013 sold about 91,300k per day. XB1 sold most likely less than 80k a day. Therefore, PS4 sold more, and was fastest selling.

 

[TeKPhaN]

Anyway congrats to MS for solid X1 sales especially after all of the initial adversity(bad press 180's etc) and the ($500 X1/$60 a year XBL) price tags.

 

[DriedMangoes]

What's

What's Microsoft's WW including digital?

Not sure. I only saw this article for PS4 software sales.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/sony-ps4-sales-hit-4-2-million-9-7-million-software-sales

 

[Qbert]

Again, the discussion is about NPD... so implicitly, yes of course in NA. NPD doesn't report on WW figures.

MODS - note for the future - it would really make more sense to keep some individual threads about these topics. We get some really good, measurable data from NPD, so it should really have it's own thread. It would make the discussion *FAR* easier, and much cleaner.

The thread is a sales comparison thread, not just NPD. How about xbox fans always add "in NA" when saying "fastest selling".

 

[Flynn]

Ah well. Of to bed. Have fun posters. It's just video games guys. Titanfall and Infamous are the next big games coming out. Just have fun.

Interestingly, all the Sony execs have been quiet today. Not sure why.... (lol)

Probably because they're smarter than the Sony zealots here trying to minimize a small victory for MS. Better to just not speak, then try to defend something illogical, irrational, and easily refutable... besides, they don't need to say anything more than "4.2 million WW, and most cumulative sales in NA" to make the point clear that they've sold more units WW, and more total units in NA.

They're winning the race right now, but we all know it's not a sprint... it's a very long marathon, and the next few months will be really interesting to watch. Here's to hoping that the divide never gets TOO big, but that we ultimately come away with the win (like we did last gen).

 

[Flynn]

Not sure. I only saw this article for PS4 software sales.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/sony-ps4-sales-hit-4-2-million-9-7-million-software-sales

Then how can you claim "best so far"? Seems to me the only claim you can make is that PS4 has sold X number of units, and we don't know how many units X1 has sold, though (presumably) it's less, since MS would probably want to mention that they'd sold more games than Sony if it were indeed true.

Not to get all anal on you, I just really dislike claims to truth which aren't substantiated better.

 

[Qbert]

What's

What's Microsoft's WW including digital?

Not sure, no one discloses that. I think the only one that comes close to showing us what's really selling best is amazon. No other outlet discloses that. And certainly no one discloses digital.

So many games were purchased digitally and, then that whole 10 bucks to upgrade digital version....it's really hard to tell.

 

[Flynn]

The thread is a sales comparison thread, not just NPD.

Exactly, which is why I'd like the mods to give us another thread for NPD.

I didn't come into this thread to talk about WW numbers, as that was already discussed with Sony and MS announced them.

Today's topic is NPD, which is NA only... and all my posts today are under that assumption.

How about xbox fans always add "in NA" when saying "fastest selling".

I don't intentionally *not* add that, but it's a little annoying to have to preface every statement I make with "IN NA, IN DECEMBER, IN 2013" - since (in my mind) that's implicit, being that we're discussing NPD numbers.

 

[Qbert]

Probably because they're smarter than the Sony zealots here trying to minimize a small victory for MS.

Pretty much all of us have said kudos to MS, even Val has. No one is minimizing how well MS is doing.

 

[TeKPhaN]

Now we want another thread lolz

 

[Qbert]

Exactly, which is why I'd like the mods to give us another thread for NPD.

I didn't come into this thread to talk about WW numbers, as that was already discussed with Sony and MS announced them.

Today's topic is NPD, which is NA only... and all my posts today are under that assumption.

Fair enough, maybe there should be another thread for NPD only. But in this particular thread, since it is about sales in generally, it would be nice if people saying "fastest selling" would always add "in NA" to be clear.

 

[Flynn]

No one is minimizing how well MS is doing.

Sure they are - and you're one of them... VaLLiancE is another.

You're trying to say that legitimate claims to Xbox One's "fastest selling" title for 2013 in NA is "cherry picking", and from your own words - you think it's a statement about "popularity", which it's factually not.

I don't know why it's so difficult for you to admit that yes, (in December) the Xbox One sold more units in NA than Sony did, and therefore it's the fastest selling console in NA.

I'm being serious when I say I don't understand that, and I'm seriously curious why it's hard for you to admit, and why you believe it's cherry picking when it's demonstrably and provably not.

 

[TeKPhaN]

lol

 

[Flynn]

Oh my god, you really don't know what cherry picking is, do you. Cherry picking is indeed taking FACTUAL statements to make someone look better than what it really is. Everything above is cherry picking.

Fact, from date of release, PS4 is the fastest selling console. Period. Taking snippets of time to make it appear as if XB1 was fastest selling is cherry picking. Yes, using those time periods are factual, and no one is saying it's false, but it's picking pockets of data for a hidden agenda.


Again, bottom line, PS4 is fastest selling. Using the same metrics that MS fans like to use for Nov.... PS4 in 2013 sold about 91,300k per day. XB1 sold most likely less than 80k a day. Therefore, PS4 sold more, and was fastest selling.

As mentioned, PS4 is the fastest selling WW, and Xbox One is the fastest selling in NA.

No cherry picking. Just the facts.

 

[Qbert]

Sure they are - and you're one of them... Viktor is another.

You're trying to say that legitimate claims to Xbox One's "fastest selling" title for 2013 in NA is "cherry picking", and from your own words - you think it's a statement about "popularity", which it's factually not.

I don't know why it's so difficult for you to admit that yes, (in December) the Xbox One sold more units in NA than Sony did, and therefore it's the fastest selling console in NA.

I'm being serious when I say I don't understand that, and I'm seriously curious why it's hard for you to admit, and why you believe it's cherry picking when it's demonstrably and provably not.

Am I in the twilight zone or something? When did I say that XB1 wasn't fastest selling in NA???????

My bone of contention is people throwing around this "fastest selling" in Dec, but not always saying in NA. And please, by the definition of cherry picking, tell me how it's not cherry picking. It's using data from one territory, and ignoring others.

I've given XB1 kudos. I've said quite often that BOTH consoles have sold incredibly well. Not sure why you think I'm minimizing their success. Why? Because I think it's cherry picking to talk numbers about one territory and ignoring others?



I think some of you are confusing cherry picking with lying. I've yet to see anyone "prove" that there's no cherry picking. If anything, by definition, it is.

 

[Flynn]

Fair enough, maybe there should be another thread for NPD only.

Yep. I think there really should be.

But in this particular thread, since it is about sales in generally, it would be nice if people saying "fastest selling" would always add "in NA" to be clear.

I have no problem with that, and I'll certainly continue to try to do that...

...and I hope in the times when it's missed, people can have a bit of grace and assume it's not intentional.

 

[Cody32599]

So in America Xbox sold 100k les total but sold 600k more games? Impressive.

 

[Qbert]

Anyway, wife is done coloring her hair. Out for the night to spend time with wifey.

 

[Flynn]

Am I in the twilight zone or something? When did I say that XB1 wasn't fastest selling in NA???????

My bone of contention is people throwing around this "fastest selling" in Dec, but not always saying in NA. And please, by the definition of cherry picking, tell me how it's not cherry picking. It's using data from one territory, and ignoring others.

I've given XB1 kudos. I've said quite often that BOTH consoles have sold incredibly well. Not sure why you think I'm minimizing their success. Why? Because I think it's cherry picking to talk numbers about one territory and ignoring others?

I think we're just missing the core context of each other's posts.

You're coming from a WW perspective... and yes, this thread is about WW (not just NPD), so I see nothing wrong with your desire for information regarding NPD figures to be prefaced with "NA", and "December 2013", etc... with that context, you're right - just talking about NA is cherry picking... but that's not my context.

I came into this thread to talk about NPD numbers... Another poster created an NPD thread, but it was merged with this one (which I can understand why a MOD would do that, but I really think it makes sense to keep those topics separate, if only for this reason alone). With that context, it's not cherry picking in any way. It's the core topic, with raw numbers in their entirety.

Since WW numbers have already been discussed ad-nauseum, I was interested in NPD/NA numbers specifically... and therefore, that's the context of my posts. Honestly, I didn't mean to imply otherwise.