Series X and PS5 discussion. Of TFlops and SSDs

Two Pennys Worth

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2% which is less than the 10% originally reported.
IGN nobody takes serious in anything.
He doesn’t actually say 2% though does he? He says to reduce power by 10% only takes about a 2% drop in frequency. In other words a 2% drop in frequency results in a 10% drop in power. 9.2 tf GPU confirmed

Lot’s of maybes from Cerny but nothing definitive. Even the boost giving the 10 + tf is misleading because RDNA have shown to not scale in power linearly so a GPU that’s actually 10.3 TF will be more powerful than a 9.? TF that boosts to a theoretical 10.3.
 
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Swede

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Xsx more powerful is fact, devs will make better looking multiplat games on xbox if not retarded. Ps5 might have a bit faster loading in theory, but lol at buying a console with inferior graphics for a few seconds of better loading.
Buying a ps5 for exclusives seems reasonable though.
 

VaLLiancE

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He doesn’t actually say 2% though does he? He says to reduce power by 10% on takes about a 2% drop in frequency. In other words a 2% drop in frequency results in a 10% drop in power. 9.2 tf GPU confirmed

Lot’s of maybes from Cerny but nothing definitive. Even the boost giving the 10 + tf is misleading because RDNA have shown to not scale in power linearly so a GPU that’s actually 10.3 TF will be more powerful than a 9.? TF that boosts to a theoretical 10.3.
The 10% drop in power is the power draw.
The 2% drop is performance which is clearly stated and doesn't always drop to....
= 2185.4 ghz which is about 10TF's still.
 
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hrudey

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The 10% drop in power is the power draw.
The 2% drop is performance which is clearly stated and doesn't always drop to....
= 2185.4 ghz which is about 10TF's still.
You might note that the 10% drop in power was never said to be the range. Instead, that's probably the part where they're really pushing frequency, so if they needed to drop 20% power draw, it could be more like 7-10 % in frequency loss. Now, with that said, we also don't know how often a drop in power is going to be required, but if we wait for facts we'd never hear from some posters again. Hmm...
 

VaLLiancE

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You might note that the 10% drop in power was never said to be the range. Instead, that's probably the part where they're really pushing frequency, so if they needed to drop 20% power draw, it could be more like 7-10 % in frequency loss. Now, with that said, we also don't know how often a drop in power is going to be required, but if we wait for facts we'd never hear from some posters again. Hmm...
Thankfully Cerny said what it was.
 

The Living Tribunal

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Nope for that to be true XSX would have to be superior in every way.
It has more compute units...so objectively on PAPER it is more powerful no matter how slight you think it is.

Remember.

12 > 10.

Not

12 = 10

OR

12 >= 10

12 is greater. Period. It can never be equal.
I feel like I'm in a programming class again lol.

Computationally XSX can do more general purpose processing. That is factual unless you want to tell me 10 is somehow a bigger number.
 
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VaLLiancE

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It has more compute unites....so objectively on PAPER it is more powerful no matter how slight you think it is.

Remember.

12 > 10.

Not

12 = 10

OR

12 >= 10

12 is greater. Period. It can never be equal.
I feel like I'm in a programming class again lol.

Computationally XSX can do more general purpose processing. That is factual unless you want to tell me 10 is somehow a bigger number.
That's ONE aspect
 

The Living Tribunal

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That's ONE aspect
That is why I said on paper it is more powerful. You can't argue the overall number. With everything considered OUTSIDE OF SSDs and other wizardry the power output of these consoles has been established.
Hence in totality of said parts 12 > 10.
Saying that the XSX is more powerful shouldn't be a point of contention because it's true.
If anyone is triggered by that statement it's because they refuse to accept 12 is a bigger number but such a person may have other problems outside of 2nd grade math.
 
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hrudey

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Thankfully Cerny said what it was.
He said they expect the GPU would spend most of it's time at or near that frequency, which is two layers of approximation on an expectation. See at 37:39 or so:

The ten percent is definitely just their best case example. Clearly, reducing clocks by 20 percent wouldn't reduce power draw to 0. 🧐 We'll just have to wait and see how frequently those drops are actually required in real games and how large those drops end up being, and hopefully it's mostly in that 2/10 scenario.
 

VaLLiancE

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That is why I said on paper it is more powerful. You can't argue the overall number. With everything considered OUTSIDE OF SSDs and other wizardry the power output of these consoles has been established.
Hence in totality of said parts 12 > 10.
Saying that the XSX is more powerful shouldn't be a point of contention because it's true.
If anyone is triggered by that statement it's because they refuse to accept 12 is a bigger number but such a person may have other problems outside of 2nd grade math.
Everything considered besides the SSD.
The GPU clock of the PS5 is faster.
Plus the PS5 has a overall better/(more available)ram architecture.
 

VaLLiancE

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He said they expect the GPU would spend most of it's time at or near that frequency, which is two layers of approximation on an expectation. See at 37:39 or so:

The ten percent is definitely just their best case example. Clearly, reducing clocks by 20 percent wouldn't reduce power draw to 0. 🧐 We'll just have to wait and see how frequently those drops are actually required in real games and how large those drops end up being, and hopefully it's mostly in that 2/10 scenario.
10% drop in power draw.
Couple(=2) % drop in performance
Which=roughly 10TF's
 

The Living Tribunal

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Seeing this I'm really curious to see how Sony tackles the heat situation with their console design. With that high GPU clock their cooling solution has to be rock solid.

Everything considered besides the SSD.
The GPU clock of the PS5 is faster.
Plus the PS5 has a overall better/(more available)ram architecture.
If it was overall the more powerful system it would be greater than 12TFs. It's not. Hence the XSX is more powerful. GPU clock is faster but with less CUs and a narrower bus width compared to XSX.
 

Frozpot

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Seeing this I'm really curious to see how Sony tackles the heat situation with their console design. With that high GPU clock their cooling solution has to be rock solid.



If it was overall the more powerful system it would be greater than 12TFs. It's not. Hence the XSX is more powerful. GPU clock is faster but with less CUs and a narrower bus width compared to XSX.
I said this from the beginning. Actually seeing DF vid really drives home how much the heat generation needs to be mitigated. That 70% increase in airflow is pretty neat. Having the two motherboards so they could deal with heat dissipation is interesting too, along with the cyclonic airflow facilitated by the tower design.

Now couple that with the knowledge that PS5 is clocked very high, and the silicone is apparently much smaller, I'm not surprised to hear rumors of cooling issues.

I'm very interested to see how they tackle this. Itll be interesting to see price differences as well. I've no doubt Sonys SSD will be more expensive, and they'll likely be spending a good bit on cooling.
 
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VaLLiancE

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Seeing this I'm really curious to see how Sony tackles the heat situation with their console design. With that high GPU clock their cooling solution has to be rock solid.



If it was overall the more powerful system it would be greater than 12TFs. It's not. Hence the XSX is more powerful. GPU clock is faster but with less CUs and a narrower bus width compared to XSX.
I never said it was overall better.
I said it's not a fact that XSX is more powerful because it doesn't beat the PS5 in every way as both have strengths.
 

The Living Tribunal

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I never said it was overall better.
I said it's not a fact that XSX is more powerful because it doesn't beat the PS5 in every way as both have strengths.
On paper it is factually more powerful. Paper specs are all we have right now. Just like on paper a 12TF GPU is more powerful than a 10TF GPU.
I will agree that PS5 will likely punch above its weight though.