The End of the World: A Political Thread. A New Hope coming soon!

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Plainview said:
I don't agree. Given the amount of dick sucking the "republican" party is doing for a child rapist, and the fact that his supporters are domestic terrorists who have killed people, it took a LOT to make that stance. People are already calling for his death.
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Nah, he's doing that for the sake of the power structure. We usually have a choice between two wings of the establishment party when we vote. Moderate corporatists vs controlled opposition. Controlled opposition like Joe Biden and Pelosi who's job it is to pretend to be the "voice of reason" and cave at the last minute every time. A rigged game of chicken.

Now with this "NeverTrump" movement moderates get to reinvent themselves as woke freedom fighters while they pull the party towards the center and take money from corporate interests just as they always have.
 
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GeorgeSoros said:
Nah, he's doing that for the sake of the power structure. We usually have a choice between two wings of the establishment party when we vote. Moderate corporatists vs controlled opposition. Controlled opposition like Joe Biden and Pelosi who's job it is to pretend to be the "voice of reason" and cave at the last minute every time. A rigged game of chicken.

Now with this "NeverTrump" movement moderates get to reinvent themselves as woke freedom fighters while they pull they party towards the center and take money from corporate interests just as they always have.
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Yeah, what annoys me most is all of these never trump Republicans trying to pull dems even further to the right so they can vote for our candidate one time before turning around and demonizing them again once Trump is gone. I get so sick and tired of people like Steve Schmidt, Meghan McCain and others telling us that we need to nominate someone that they find acceptable, they don't believe in the same things Democrats do, hell they mostly agree with Trump they just don't like how abrasive he is, I doubt Meghan McCain would have any problem with him had he not attacked her father.
 
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Gabbards's final vote tally was 15 votes in Iowa

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JinCA said:
Yeah, what annoys me most is all of these never trump Republicans trying to pull dems even further to the right so they can vote for our candidate one time before turning around and demonizing them again once Trump is gone.
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Most of them really want to push us much further left though. They would much rather have Bernie win than Biden. Biden is a threat to votes they got, while they feel they can rip Bernie to shreds. They will play the "higher taxes, more government" card. This is why they are going so hard after Biden. Fox News top story is more on the Hunter Biden investigation.

They feel that they will be able to scare people away from Bernie (and I fear they are right). Bernie has always been an idealist and he likely won't water down his message for the general election. For years they tried to paint Obama as a radical socialist (and look how well it worked even though it was absolute nonsense). Imagine having a real socialist for them to attack?
 
Kerosene31 said:
Most of them really want to push us much further left though. They would much rather have Bernie win than Biden. Biden is a threat to votes they got, while they feel they can rip Bernie to shreds. They will play the "higher taxes, more government" card. This is why they are going so hard after Biden. Fox News top story is more on the Hunter Biden investigation.

They feel that they will be able to scare people away from Bernie (and I fear they are right). Bernie has always been an idealist and he likely won't water down his message for the general election. For years they tried to paint Obama as a radical socialist (and look how well it worked even though it was absolute nonsense). Imagine having a real socialist for them to attack?
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Bernie might beat Trump but he is definitely better for the GOP in Senate races.

Its just unfortunate the reverse isn't true as the GOP can go as far right as they want with no consequences.
 
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Kerosene31 said:
Most of them really want to push us much further left though. They would much rather have Bernie win than Biden. Biden is a threat to votes they got, while they feel they can rip Bernie to shreds. They will play the "higher taxes, more government" card. This is why they are going so hard after Biden. Fox News top story is more on the Hunter Biden investigation.

They feel that they will be able to scare people away from Bernie (and I fear they are right). Bernie has always been an idealist and he likely won't water down his message for the general election. For years they tried to paint Obama as a radical socialist (and look how well it worked even though it was absolute nonsense). Imagine having a real socialist for them to attack?
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Bernie is looking to thrash Biden on super Tuesday if the current polling holds up, the supposed "front runner' Biden is only favored to win two states and he's relying on a superpac because he's already maxed out the people who are willing to donate to his primary campaign. No matter who the nominee is they'll be called a socialist, we may as well nominate someone with big ideas who can inspire people and not someone we are all worried about who brings no energy. Personally I would rather we nominate Yang but I know that's not going to happen, the contrast with Trump would be huge, he really comes off as someone who cares and he doesn't demonize the other side, the guy has a lot of crossover appeal but sadly just hasn't been able to grab enough people's interest. As far as Obama the guy won two terms so clearly the painting him as a socialist only worked in their own bubble.
 
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JinCA said:
Bernie is looking to thrash Biden on super Tuesday if the current polling holds up, the supposed "front runner' Biden is only favored to win two states and he's relying on a superpac because he's already maxed out the people who are willing to donate to his primary campaign. No matter who the nominee is they'll be called a socialist, we may as well nominate someone with big ideas who can inspire people and not someone we are all worried about who brings no energy. Personally I would rather we nominate Yang but I know that's not going to happen, the contrast with Trump would be huge, he really comes off as someone who cares and he doesn't demonize the other side, the guy has a lot of crossover appeal but sadly just hasn't been able to grab enough people's interest. As far as Obama the guy won two terms so clearly the painting him as a socialist only worked in their own bubble.
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I don't really buy the idea that Bernie is favored in all these states. I know 538's model is saying that but its not polling based and Nate Silver doesn't even seem to have that much confidence in it. Its hard to say where the race goes because you don't really know what momentum occurs and when people drop out. What happens if Bernie doesn't win any of the next 3? I was definitely wrong in thinking the big field would help Biden though. Pete and Bloomberg are really bad for him but Pete winning NH would be bad for Bernie too.

I think some of these electibility concerns can solve themselves through the course of a primary. If Bernie can't build on his base by adding Hillary voters he won't win and shouldn't win. Its still a real concern for him because he wasn't the second choice of the voters of any other candidate in Iowa. If Biden can't the turnout then he won't win and you know that he shouldn't either. That is why I kind of roll my eyes at the idea that it should be Yang. A lot of the candidates may have been great in a general election but if your campaign never goes anywhere where its serious then its kind of hard to discuss it like it is. He has the most conservative health care plan but nobody knows this because he was never in a position where he would have any flaw exposed. If we had 4 parties maybe it would be different but we don't.

I do agree that everyone will be called a socialist but we know people are more willing to buy it about someone who has called themselves one. The argument for Bernie is turnout among people you think won't turnout and less about winning Trump voters. Or you don't care about electibility at all and its purely worth the risk because you believe he will do so much more. I like the idea of President Bernie more than President Biden but I find both their arguments about how and why they will get the things done that they want to to be ridiculous.
 
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yankeessuck said:
I don't really buy the idea that Bernie is favored in all these states. I know 538's model is saying that but its not polling based and Nate Silver doesn't even seem to have that much confidence in it. Its hard to say where the race goes because you don't really know what momentum occurs and when people drop out. What happens if Bernie doesn't win any of the next 3? I was definitely wrong in thinking the big field would help Biden though. Pete and Bloomberg are really bad for him but Pete winning NH would be bad for Bernie too.

I think some of these electibility concerns can solve themselves through the course of a primary. If Bernie can't build on his base by adding Hillary voters he won't win and shouldn't win. Its still a real concern for him because he wasn't the second choice of the voters of any other candidate in Iowa. If Biden can't the turnout then he won't win and you know that he shouldn't either. That is why I kind of roll my eyes at the idea that it should be Yang. A lot of the candidates may have been great in a general election but if your campaign never goes anywhere where its serious then its kind of hard to discuss it like it is. He has the most conservative health care plan but nobody knows this because he was never in a position where he would have any flaw exposed. If we had 4 parties maybe it would be different but we don't.

I do agree that everyone will be called a socialist but we know people are more willing to buy it about someone who has called themselves one. The argument for Bernie is turnout among people you think won't turnout and less about winning Trump voters. Or you don't care about electibility at all and its purely worth the risk because you believe he will do so much more. I like the idea of President Bernie more than President Biden but I find both their arguments about how and why they will get the things done that they want to to be ridiculous.
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Nate Silver tries his best to ignore Bernie or downplay him every chance he gets so of course he's not happy with that model. Bernie is leading in California and has been for a while and that's not likely to change, the states where he and Biden are close will probably turn more towards Bernie after Biden has his two poor showings in Iowa and New Hampshire. Yeah a lot of Biden's support is going to Buttigieg but I think he'd be a much bigger gamble than Bernie, he's also not polling particularly well in any states once you get beyond New Hampshire.

As far as Yang, I don't think he's had a real shot at getting his message out the way Bernie and other top candidates have, the media ignores him while they do everything they can to fawn over Pete, they tried to make Klobuchar a thing for months, Bernie and Biden are both candidates that everyone knows. Yeah he's a long shot for sure, an entrepreneur with no real political experience but he has a bunch of good ideas and a real focus on the issues impacting the average American today. I do agree his healthcare plan seems to be the lest progressive but then again if he's making it so everyone gets an extra $1k a month maybe it doesn't have to be as aggressive early on.
 
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JinCA said:
As far as Yang, I don't think he's had a real shot at getting his message out the way Bernie and other top candidates have, the media ignores him while they do everything they can to fawn over Pete, they tried to make Klobuchar a thing for months, Bernie and Biden are both candidates that everyone knows. Yeah he's a long shot for sure, an entrepreneur with no real political experience but he has a bunch of good ideas and a real focus on the issues impacting the average American today. I do agree his healthcare plan seems to be the lest progressive but then again if he's making it so everyone gets an extra $1k a month maybe it doesn't have to be as aggressive early on.
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Yang keeps impressing me with being in tune with technology and ideas on how we can adapt to it instead of passively crush labor sectors when their skills are automated away.

I do think he could have done more to get his message out that doesn't necessarily have to do with waving for attention at the stupid debates. He did joke early on about doing a kind of "Hologram" appearance. Now that is a bit far out and probably expensive so I'm glad that didn't happen, but I would have thought any connections in Silicon Valley could back him up.

I mean what if Yang and supporters crafted a plan to pilot Drones with Yang 2020 signs? That would be kind of apt and futuristic, but with tech that is becoming familiar. Actually, for a short term Drone rental program if not crazy expensive, a small fleet of say 20 or so Drones displaying Yang 2020 might convey a message that we need to be paying attention to him and the future we're heading into.
 
JinCA said:
Nate Silver tries his best to ignore Bernie or downplay him every chance he gets so of course he's not happy with that model. Bernie is leading in California and has been for a while and that's not likely to change, the states where he and Biden are close will probably turn more towards Bernie after Biden has his two poor showings in Iowa and New Hampshire. Yeah a lot of Biden's support is going to Buttigieg but I think he'd be a much bigger gamble than Bernie, he's also not polling particularly well in any states once you get beyond New Hampshire.

As far as Yang, I don't think he's had a real shot at getting his message out the way Bernie and other top candidates have, the media ignores him while they do everything they can to fawn over Pete, they tried to make Klobuchar a thing for months, Bernie and Biden are both candidates that everyone knows. Yeah he's a long shot for sure, an entrepreneur with no real political experience but he has a bunch of good ideas and a real focus on the issues impacting the average American today. I do agree his healthcare plan seems to be the lest progressive but then again if he's making it so everyone gets an extra $1k a month maybe it doesn't have to be as aggressive early on.
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If Biden can just hold on to SC and win it especially with a decent margin I think he would be fine on Super Tuesday since Pete still isn't in a position to steal much of the black vote. I still think he beats Bernie head to head but its highly question if gets there or gets there fast enough. Either way I hope someone runs away with it. Brokered convention would just be a nightmare.

Once upon a time nobody knew Bernie Sanders and Iowa was just "won" by a small town Mayor. Still think what Yang has done is impressive but its time to drop out and endorse Bernie. He can run again in the future.
 
The problem is enough people don't know the difference between communism and socialism, so their nonsense arguments still scare people.

The right has learned that the truth is irrelevant. The "truth" is what you can convince poor and middle class white people to believe when they vote.
 
So, if you have any tiny shred of hope for the future left... this interview will remove it.

Bannon likes Bernie too and sees him as a populist kept down by the "establishment". That should set off red flags.

 
yankeessuck said:
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Ouch
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Everyone but Biden gained, the establishment needs to get behind someone else he's a sure loser and I say that as someone who actually likes him. Amy Klobuchar would be a better nominee than he or Mayor Pete IMO and she's about as exciting as a brick wall.
 
This Biden ad is pretty funny.


Edit: I just saw footage of Buttigieg defending Biden and his son against republican attacks last night, maybe this ad shouldn't have gone up lol.
 
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Videodrome said:
I don't get the loyalty to this guy on the right. Didn't they all hate him during the primary until they all failed miserably then suddenly they all stand by him?

I think all the fake tan has been seeping into his brain.
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Imo I'm guessing they didn't know where he actually stood since he has voted and supported dems in the past. Now he has either proven to align with their conservative views or it would be political suicide not to support him at this point.
 
JinCA said:
Everyone but Biden gained, the establishment needs to get behind someone else he's a sure loser and I say that as someone who actually likes him. Amy Klobuchar would be a better nominee than he or Mayor Pete IMO and she's about as exciting as a brick wall.
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If Biden implodes there might not be enough time to get behind someone else unless some drop out real soon. You might see everyone stubbornly staying in and Bernie would just gobble up lots of delegates without having to get big percentages.
 
Kerosene31 said:
Politicians on both sides have learned that the truth is irrelevant. The "truth" is what you can convince poor and middle class white people to believe when they vote.
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I fixed it for you...
 
Plainview said:
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Justin still got Barack's endorsement after the BF scandal a week before the election. Some would say foreign meddling in elections...lol. Justin was able to get something Biden can't Barack's endorsement. So we have to ask what has Joe done to anger Barack?
 
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yankeessuck said:
If Biden implodes there might not be enough time to get behind someone else unless some drop out real soon. You might see everyone stubbornly staying in and Bernie would just gobble up lots of delegates without having to get big percentages.
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The only reason Bloomberg got in and that Klobuchar is staying in is that they likely expect Biden to implode, I wish he'd drop out now but he won't. I know he's considered a front runner but still his support is soft and he's clearly just not up to the task IMO.
 
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JinCA said:
The only reason Bloomberg got in and that Klobuchar is staying in is that they likely expect Biden to implode, I wish he'd drop out now but he won't. I know he's considered a front runner but still his support is soft and he's clearly just not up to the task IMO.
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If Biden dropped everyone else would benefit more than Klobuchar. She would really need to have a good showing in NH otherwise she is probably going to drop. Especially with Pete getting a bump and Bloomberg flooding the airwaves with ads. Warren would make a way better argument than her too but she isn't likely to outlast Biden either.

Biden's campaign has been poor it but I think if the order of the states was different he would have won easily. Which could be a blessing.
 
JinCA said:
The only reason Bloomberg got in and that Klobuchar is staying in is that they likely expect Biden to implode, I wish he'd drop out now but he won't. I know he's considered a front runner but still his support is soft and he's clearly just not up to the task IMO.
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When did he join the race? Days after the tariffs on China. Is he top 10 wealthiest person on planet? How much has he invested in China? Just asking...lol
 
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