Killzone: Shadow Fall Multiplayer Runs at 960x1080

[blue]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-in-theory-1080p30-or-720p60


Originally Posted by Richard Leadbetter

In the single-player mode, the game runs at full 1080p with an unlocked frame-rate (though a 30fps cap has been introduced as an option in a recent patch), but it's a different story altogether with multiplayer. Here Guerrilla Games has opted for a 960x1080 framebuffer, in pursuit of a 60fps refresh. Across a range of clips, we see the game handing in a 50fps average on multiplayer. It makes a palpable difference, but it's probably not the sort of boost you might expect from halving fill-rate.

Now, there are some mitigating factors here. Shadow Fall uses a horizontal interlace, with every other column of pixels generated using a temporal upscale - in effect, information from previously rendered frames is used to plug the gaps. The fact that few have actually noticed that any upscale at all is in place speaks to its quality, and we can almost certainly assume that this effect is not cheap from a computational perspective. However, at the same time it also confirms that a massive reduction in fill-rate isn't a guaranteed dead cert for hitting 60fps. Indeed, Shadow Fall multiplayer has a noticeably variable frame-rate - even though the fill-rate gain and the temporal upscale are likely to give back and take away fixed amounts of GPU time. Whatever is stopping Killzone from reaching 60fps isn't down to pixel fill-rate, and based on what we learned from our trip to Amsterdam last year, we're pretty confident it's not the CPU in this case either.

 

[Andy]

We know...

 

[blue]

We know...

I know, but I like the other thread for actual game discussion. Reading some of the posts in there is actually painful. At the least, we can keep that discussion in here.

 

[Andy]

I know, but I like the other thread for actual game discussion. Reading some of the posts in there is actually painful. At the least, we can keep that discussion in here.

Maybe we should have two separate threads for each game -- one where people are talking about the game and the other where people are arguing about resolution and framerates.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

Someone moved that thread into the KZ thread, I believe so. Maybe you know that. I'm all for more thread for new threads, hate mega threads.

I guess it was Anderson, you guys are gonna have to decide the best course of action together

I guess you are joking Anderson, but less mega threads would be welcome for me atleast.

Either way, whoever thought the mp looked good before this came out probably didn't even play it.

 

[blue]

Maybe we should have two separate threads for each game -- one where people are talking about the game and the other where people are arguing about resolution and framerates.

Considering the way this generation is going, I'm afraid that's actually a good idea.

 

[Andy]

Someone moved that thread into the KZ thread, I believe so. Maybe you know that. I'm all for more thread for new threads, hate mega threads.

I guess it was Anderson, you guys are gonna have to decide the best course of action together

I guess you are joking Anderson, but less mega threads would be welcome for me atleast.

Either way, whoever thought the mp looked good before this came out probably didn't even play it.

Yeah, I merged Flynn's thread into the KZ thread. Now blue pulls them apart. I defer to blue, because he has two weeks seniority.

I was joking about two separate threads. I personally don't want the headaches as a moderator, trying to keep resolution/framerate discussions and gameplay discussions separate on the same games. Bit of a pain.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

Some people seem to be a little confused at the resolution thinking that it upscales from 960x1080 to 1920x1080 like you would upscale a sub 1080p game to 1080p, it doesn't. I made some images to help.

Okay, so let's say the red lines are what is being updated while the black lines are empty space.

Now this is what it looks like on frame 1
On frame 2 this is what it looks like

And when frame 2 comes it it blurs the information from frame 1 to fill in the black spaces. This is why it looks fine when standing still but looks blurry and odd in motion. If we could take a single frame of KZSF's multiplayer with this effect turned off it would look something like this.
Zoom in to see the full effect.

The grey lines are dead space where nothing is being rendered on this frame.

So techinically the game is rendering at 1920x1080, just not on each frame.



This was said at gaf, apparently its technically half 1080p but this whole set up is strange... so it wasnt exactly a full lie as some have been saying perhaps.


I thought it looked bad my self not only technically but artistically across the board when I played it.

 

[blue]

I was joking about two separate threads. I personally don't want the headaches as a moderator, trying to keep resolution/framerate discussions and gameplay discussions separate on the same games. Bit of a pain.

Just do what I do: filter all the crap to one thread, and never visit it, ever. Eventually, all members will eat themselves.

Wait, this isn't the Mods Only forum. Perhaps we should move this discussion.

 

[Ceger]

Some people seem to be a little confused at the resolution thinking that it upscales from 960x1080 to 1920x1080 like you would upscale a sub 1080p game to 1080p, it doesn't. I made some images to help.

Okay, so let's say the red lines are what is being updated while the black lines are empty space.

Now this is what it looks like on frame 1
On frame 2 this is what it looks like

And when frame 2 comes it it blurs the information from frame 1 to fill in the black spaces. This is why it looks fine when standing still but looks blurry and odd in motion. If we could take a single frame of KZSF's multiplayer with this effect turned off it would look something like this.
Zoom in to see the full effect.

The grey lines are dead space where nothing is being rendered on this frame.

So techinically the game is rendering at 1920x1080, just not on each frame.



This was said at gaf, apparently its technically half 1080p but this whole set up is strange... so it wasnt exactly a full lie as some have been saying perhaps.


I thought it looked bad my self not only technically but artistically across the board when I played it.

It is a lie as it is more in common with 1080I than 1080P, so it is NOT in fact 1080P.

So for the pixel pushers here, that is actually less pixel fill rate than a game rendered at 900P.

960x1080 = 1,036,800 pixels
1600x900 = 1,400,000 pixels

That's all I have to say about it.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

It is a lie as it is more in common with 1080I than 1080P, so it is NOT in fact 1080P.

So for the pixel pushers here, that is actually less pixel fill rate than a game rendered at 900P.

960x1080 = 1,036,800 pixels
1600x900 = 1,400,000 pixels

That's all I have to say about it.

It doesn't seem to be saying that actually, it's sayine one frame is 1080 the next isn't from what I understand

 

[DriedMangoes]

Flynn, I think that what you don't get what the big deal is because you confused some of the Xbox One games at sub full HD as being the big deal when it's actually the fact we know that the same game can be rendered at full HD on the PS4 and Xbox One didn't as the big deal. That's the difference. We're not saying games at sub HD is the big deal, just that when it's possible to be full HD on the other console, it's worth a mention.

 

[Obscene Jester]

It doesn't seem to be saying that actually, it's sayine one frame is 1080 the next isn't from what I understand

From the DF article, its sounds like it is a horizontal interlace where half the pixels are being interpolated from the previous frame. So it is displaying 1920 lines every frame, but only half are "real". If we weren't all caught up in resolution-gate, we could probably be discussing how innovative a technique this is. Not sure what Crytek is doing exactly with Ryse, but these are two impressive examples of what smart developers can come up with to negate native resolution.

 

[Ceger]

It doesn't seem to be saying that actually, it's sayine one frame is 1080 the next isn't from what I understand

It's rendering 960 across in actual game information per frame and blending in information from the previous frame. that is basically interlaced or the I in the equation. They are rendering half the information per frame.

 

[Obscene Jester]

It's rendering 960 across in actual game information per frame and blending in information from the previous frame. that is basically interlaced or the I in the equation. They are rendering half the information per frame.

Well it's not exactly fair to just call it interlaced as that would imply that it is only displaying 960 lines per frame. The interpolating of the other 960 lines from the previous frame does certainly require computation.

 

[Ceger]

Well it's not exactly fair to just call it interlaced as that would imply that it is only displaying 960 lines per frame. The interpolating of the other 960 lines from the previous frame does certainly require computation.

Yes, but it is not rendering 1080P is it? Passing prior buffer info into the current display buffer is nowhere near the processing.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

makes it look blurry and bad to me, so I don't think its good

 

[Obscene Jester]

Yes, but it is not rendering 1080P is it? Passing prior buffer info into the current display buffer is nowhere near the processing.

No, but the point it does seem to be a complex interlace/interpolation hybrid. Of course it is not as processing intensive as rendering 1080p (or what would be the point) but it isn't a simple interlace either.

makes it look blurry and bad to me, so I don't think its good

You are in the minority with that opinion. While it doesn't look as good as the SP, I think it looks really good and so do most others that never even thought about this until DF mentioned it.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

Would be nice to see similar parts of the game in mp and sp. No photos like that around?

 

[DriedMangoes]

Would be nice to see similar parts of the game in mp and sp. No photos like that around?

The only map I can think of that resembles the SP campaign is the end part of the SP and that MP map with the garden and trees, forget the name. I sold my KZ: SF so maybe someone else can take pics? From what I remember though, it looked good in MP.

 

[Viktor]

I like threads of pain and suffering like this so the official thread doesn't get bogged down with Xbro bulls***.

 

[starseeker]

Ok, whats the purpose of this thread?

Ok, say Sony misinform, or even lied (Yes its bad, no doubt), its means that we cannot from now on take their word at face value. Sony do have a history of inflated claims, & borderline, or downright lying, like Claiming PS2 to be significantly more powerful than dreamcast then actual, & later that PS3 is much more powerful than XBOX360.

Its good that people pointed it out, & question them. They should be ashame if they intended to misinform.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

I guess it's technically not full blown lying, it is in some ways. With the way it's coded it would be strange to put it as 720p or 1080p on the box in some ways.I guess you'd have to ask your self that question. If it was your studio and game and knowing and seeing how it is coded to handle 1080p would you list it at 1080 or 720. I think some of our answers would vary versus what we feel at the consumer level. If you are being a little reasonable maybe. I think they should list it at 1080 but they should inform the ones who stay up to date about how they got there.

 

[starseeker]

I guess it's technically not full blown lying, it is in some ways. With the way it's coded it would be strange to put it as 720p or 1080p on the box in some ways.I guess you'd have to ask your self that question. If it was your studio and game and knowing and seeing how it is coded to handle 1080p would you list it at 1080 or 720. I think some of our answers would vary versus what we feel at the consumer level. If you are being a little reasonable maybe. I think they should list it at 1080 but they should inform the ones who stay up to date about how they got there.

I would say its 1080, but its not in a traditional sense, but using a filtering technique probably, & it will look good in action.

 

[jimmyD]

 

[Hissatsu]

The MP still looks cleaner than all the xb1 games I've seen save for maybe forza.

 

[TDbank24]

Maybe we should have two separate threads for each game -- one where people are talking about the game and the other where people are arguing about resolution and framerates.

That's a great idea. The only problem is the thread about the actual game wouldn't last more than a page. Cause ya know, people don't actually play games for fun these days they just argue about resolution and frames per second. Gotta win that e-peen war!

 

[Hissatsu]

Resolution Gate and fps war is really the fault of sony and microsoft at the end of the day. We shouldn't have had to wait this long for a new generation and now that we've waited this long we want to see legit improvements to our games. Res and FPS are a part of that.

 

[BUSTERMAN]

Resolution Gate and fps war is really the fault of sony and microsoft at the end of the day. We shouldn't have had to wait this long for a new generation and now that we've waited this long we want to see legit improvements to our games. Res and FPS are a part of that.

Really? It has nothing to do with gamers like you being super fanboys and can’t just play games for fun without counting frames and pixels. No, surely that can’t be it.

 

[TDbank24]

Resolution Gate and fps war is really the fault of sony and microsoft at the end of the day. We shouldn't have had to wait this long for a new generation and now that we've waited this long we want to see legit improvements to our games. Res and FPS are a part of that.

This horsesh!ts been going on for ages. Hey, it's fine to have debates and "claim victory" for your console but some people take it wayyyy too far. When you're here or somewhere else posting more than you play the games you're posting about, let alone the people who don't even own the consoles are posting about them. You've got a problem.