Official Thread Making a Murderer **SPOILERS INSIDE**

Plainview

I am a sinner.
Sep 11, 2013
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rankandfile Soda Jack

Since there's at least three of us that have seen it, and there's a crap-ton to discuss about it, I figured we would make a thread to discuss it and not worry about spoilers because this is something that will ruin the series if the outcome is known.

Official SubReddit for the show. https://www.reddit.com/r/makingamurderer
Wikipedia Page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Making_a_Murderer
Slashfilm Story about evidence left out of the film. http://www.slashfilm.com/making-a-murderer-theories/

"Missing Evidence" (More at Link)

8. Avery was violent to other women
The docuseries mentioned Avery once held his female cousin at gunpoint, but the list of violence apparently didn’t end there.

The now-53-year-old allegedly raped a young girl and threatened to kill her family if they spoke out, according to a story by the Appleton Post Crescent.

Another older woman told to keep quiet also accused Avery of rape, according to the paper.

And, during a bail hearing for Avery, prosecutors said Avery had drawn up diagrams while in prison for a torture chamber to kill women.

6. Avery requested Halbach as his photographer
On the day of Halbach’s disappearance, Avery called to request “the photographer who had been out to the property previously,” according to testimony.

Avery used his sister’s name — who owned the car being photographed — when he made the photo appointment.

5. Avery called Halbach three times on the day she went missing
Prosecutors cited three phone calls Avery made to Halbach in their efforts to explain that Avery lured Halbach to his home.

For two of those phone calls, phone records indicated he used the star-67 feature, which is dialed to hide a caller’s identity.

3. Avery’s sweat was found in Halbach’s car
DNA from Avery’s sweat was found on the hood latch of the vehicle and on the car keys, according to testimony from the trial.

2. Avery allegedly molested Dassey
He goes on to tell his shocked mother that he and his brothers were touched on occasions before the Halbach murder.
 
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rankandfile Soda Jack

Since there's at least three of us that have seen it, and there's a crap-ton to discuss about it, I figured we would make a thread to discuss it and not worry about spoilers because this is something that will ruin the series if the outcome is known.

Official SubReddit for the show. https://www.reddit.com/r/makingamurderer
Wikipedia Page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Making_a_Murderer
Slashfilm Story about evidence left out of the film. http://www.slashfilm.com/making-a-murderer-theories/

"Missing Evidence" (More at Link)

8. Avery was violent to other women
The docuseries mentioned Avery once held his female cousin at gunpoint, but the list of violence apparently didn’t end there.

The now-53-year-old allegedly raped a young girl and threatened to kill her family if they spoke out, according to a story by the Appleton Post Crescent.

Another older woman told to keep quiet also accused Avery of rape, according to the paper.

And, during a bail hearing for Avery, prosecutors said Avery had drawn up diagrams while in prison for a torture chamber to kill women.

6. Avery requested Halbach as his photographer
On the day of Halbach’s disappearance, Avery called to request “the photographer who had been out to the property previously,” according to testimony.

Avery used his sister’s name — who owned the car being photographed — when he made the photo appointment.

5. Avery called Halbach three times on the day she went missing
Prosecutors cited three phone calls Avery made to Halbach in their efforts to explain that Avery lured Halbach to his home.

For two of those phone calls, phone records indicated he used the star-67 feature, which is dialed to hide a caller’s identity.

3. Avery’s sweat was found in Halbach’s car
DNA from Avery’s sweat was found on the hood latch of the vehicle and on the car keys, according to testimony from the trial.

2. Avery allegedly molested Dassey
He goes on to tell his shocked mother that he and his brothers were touched on occasions before the Halbach murder.


Im only on episode 3 or 4 so far so Im gonna wait it out first. Yes the doc is one sided and makes the Manitowoc PD seems like the keystone cops and make avery seem like lovable guy. its hard to warp one's head around the fact that avery would do this now. and the police work is as bad as the LAPD's when they prosecuted OJ.
 
Im only on episode 3 or 4 so far so Im gonna wait it out first. Yes the doc is one sided and makes the Manitowoc PD seems like the keystone cops and make avery seem like lovable guy. its hard to warp one's head around the fact that avery would do this now. and the police work is as bad as the LAPD's when they prosecuted OJ.
Only four episodes in, OK, just wait. You don;t know the ride you're on. I thought you finished it and that's why I made the thread. I don't want anything spoiled for you.
 
Watched the first episode on YouTube yesterday. Definitely seems one sides so I went and did some research about the missing evidence not presented in the documentary. It seems like he got screwed the first time around....not so sure about the second.
 
Watched the first episode on YouTube yesterday. Definitely seems one sides so I went and did some research about the missing evidence not presented in the documentary. It seems like he got screwed the first time around....not so sure about the second.
The evidence doesn't change anything in my mind. There's absolutely no way he can clean the bedroom and garage of blood. No possible way. There would be traces of it somewhere. That's the biggest piece for me. Also, the fact that only his DNA was on the key. That's not possible either. While the doc was one sided, I'm not sure you could paint the prosecution in a good light anyway. What the did with the kid, how they interrogated him, I can't believe the judge did nothing about that as far as not letting it be admissible. His blood vial was clearly tampered with. Just too many things point to a set-up.
 
Plainview have you read up any on Scott Tydach, and Bobby Dassey? They both had access, and opportunity. Ryan Hilldegas is another that needs to be looked into. Doing what he did with her phone, he could have easily known her location. Its ironic also that he not only told the searchers where to look, but also gave them a camera minutes before they found Ms. Halbachs vehicle. Hilldegas could have had motive, access, and opportunity.
 
Plainview , wow your're so right, after the pilot and the 2 episode I was pretty sure I was going to get bored like I do with most documentaries .
finished ep 4 last night,
Kratz is a sleaze ball. i thought sleaze balls were only defense attorney's like Kuchinsky (wow that guy is a real life cartoon character) and never prosecutors.
ex boyfriend, brother, and roommate are prime suspects in my book so far
 
Plainview , wow your're so right, after the pilot and the 2 episode I was pretty sure I was going to get bored like I do with most documentaries .
finished ep 4 last night,
Kratz is a sleaze ball. i thought sleaze balls were only defense attorney's like Kuchinsky (wow that guy is a real life cartoon character) and never prosecutors.
ex boyfriend, brother, and roommate are prime suspects in my book so far
Oh man, wait until the trial starts lol.
 
White House response to the petition.

Jan 8, 2016 — This response was posted by the We The People Team at the White House:

Thank you for signing a Change.org petition on the Teresa Halbach murder case, currently featured on the "Making a Murderer" documentary series. We appreciate your interest in this case.

To best respond to your petition, we should go over what exactly presidential pardoning power entails.

The U.S. Constitution grants the power of clemency to the President:

"The President ... shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States."

This clemency authority empowers the President to exercise leniency towards persons who have committed federal crimes. Under the Constitution, only federal criminal convictions, such as those adjudicated in the United States District Courts, may be pardoned by the President. In addition, the President's pardon power extends to convictions adjudicated in the Superior Court of the District of Columbia and military court-martial proceedings. However, the President cannot pardon a state criminal offense.

Since Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey are both state prisoners, the President cannot pardon them. A pardon in this case would need to be issued at the state level by the appropriate authorities.

While this case is out of the Administration's purview, President Obama is committed to restoring the sense of fairness at the heart of our justice system. That's why he has granted 184 commutations total -- more than the last five presidents combined -- and has issued 66 pardons over his time in office (https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/201...tences-more-people-last-5-presidents-combined).

This Administration has taken a number of important actions to reduce the federal prison population (https://www.bop.gov/about/statistics/population_statistics.jsp) in keeping with the President’s continuing efforts to enhance the fairness and effectiveness of the criminal justice system (https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-pres...ess-and-effectiveness-criminal-justice-system) at all phases and to better address the vicious cycle of poverty, criminality and incarceration that traps too many Americans and weakens too many communities. These include:

-Signing the Fair Sentencing Act, a bill that reduced the 100-1 sentencing disparity between crack and powder cocaine, and eliminated the mandatory minimum sentence for simple possession of crack cocaine (https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2010/08/03/president-obama-signs-fair-sentencing-act).

-The Justice Department's "Smart on Crime" initiative, in which federal prosecutors are concentrating efforts and resources on the worst offenders and avoiding triggering excessive mandatory minimums for low-level, nonviolent drug offenders (http://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/ag/legacy/2013/08/12/smart-on-crime.pdf).

-Commuting the sentences of dozens of people sentenced under outdated and unfair drug laws (https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/201...ns-video-address-america-nation-second-chance).

In 2014, President Obama also issued an Executive Order creating a Task Force on 21st Century Policing (https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2014/12/18/president-obama-creates-task-force-21st-century-policing) that produced a concrete blueprint for cities and towns seeking to put in place new strategies to build trust between law enforcement and the communities they serve while enhancing public safety. (The Task Force’s Final Report is available here: http://www.cops.usdoj.gov/policingtaskforce.)

And he has met with Americans across the country who are working to improve the criminal justice system, from law enforcement officials working to lower crime and incarceration rates, to former prisoners who are earning their second chance. Last summer, he became the first sitting president to visit a federal prison (). And he continues to work with Congress to pass meaningful criminal justice reform that makes the system more cost-effective, fairer, and smarter, while enhancing the ability of law enforcement to keep our communities safe (https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-pres...ss-working-meaningful-criminal-justice-reform).

To view our response to the Teresa Halabach murder case on We The People, click here: https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/response/response-your-petition-teresa-halbach-murder-case

Thanks again for raising your voices. We hope you'll continue to participate on the platform.

-- The We the People Team​
 
Well I finished watching what Netflix presented. I can't get over the key to the Rav 4. And then there's the bullet fragment that they find like 5 months later in the garage, how do you miss that? I don't think you do miss that....

But the key to the Rav 4. They're searching this tiny mobile home for days but don't come across the key to the vehicle for 3 days and it's just sitting under some sneakers and the cops who found it are the ones who have the clearest reason to plant evidence (and who I thought weren't allowed to be there? yet they were there and for months apparently)

I don't know how to feel about the whole thing. Feels like I'm trying to make excuses for everyone. The cops, the Avery's, the prosecutors, the defense.

Did Steven Avery kill a person?
 
Well I finished watching what Netflix presented. I can't get over the key to the Rav 4. And then there's the bullet fragment that they find like 5 months later in the garage, how do you miss that? I don't think you do miss that....

But the key to the Rav 4. They're searching this tiny mobile home for days but don't come across the key to the vehicle for 3 days and it's just sitting under some sneakers and the cops who found it are the ones who have the clearest reason to plant evidence (and who I thought weren't allowed to be there? yet they were there and for months apparently)

I don't know how to feel about the whole thing. Feels like I'm trying to make excuses for everyone. The cops, the Avery's, the prosecutors, the defense.

Did Steven Avery kill a person?
I don't think he did. He was in line to receive at least a significant sized settlement from his civil suit, as well as some form of restitution from the state in the amount of $400K if my memory is right. As soon as that crap happened he lost all of it. He got the payout from the state then had to spend every dime for his star defense lawyers. All the probable evidence tampering by the sheriffs department aside, it just doesn't make sense at all for him to do that.
 
Is it me, or wasn't the detective who found the key also in part personally financially liable for the civil suit due to the insurance company refusing to cover it?
 
Pretty damning stuff from the ex-fiance:
‘Making A Murderer’ Steven Avery Ex-Fiancee Speaks Out — Jodi Stachowski Claims He’s Guilty | Radar Online

“He threatened to kill me and my family and a friend of mine,” she said. “I was in a bath, and he threatened to throw a blow dryer in there, and he told me how would be able to get away with it. He’s sick.”

“He’s beat me all the time, punch me, throw me against the wall,” Stachowski continued, tearing up. “I tried to leave, and he smashed the windshield out of my car so I couldn’t leave him. I was at work one day, and he was up there spying through a window….He just started slapping me.”

During the trial, Stachowski said she publicly supported Avery because if she didn’t, he said she’d “pay.”

“It was all an act,” she claimed. “He told me how to act.”

She said she later asked Making A Murderer filmmakers to not use footage of her from the series, and hasn’t even seen the hit show.

“Steve’s one person I don’t trust,” she said. “He’s like Dr. Jeckyll and Mr. Hyde.”

I always felt that there was more to this guy than the documentary was showing. They tried to make him out as some sweet simpleton. The guy soaked a cat in gasoline and then threw it on a fire. Animal cruelty is an early sign of a psychopath. I think people are jumping on the he's innocent bandwagon way too quickly.

In full disclosure, I haven't watched the full documentary yet and I've heard the investigation was a mess and some of the evidence is questionable. I just have this feeling deep down that there is something wrong with Avery psychologically or there may have been some sort of abuse in his childhood.
 
Pretty damning stuff from the ex-fiance:
‘Making A Murderer’ Steven Avery Ex-Fiancee Speaks Out — Jodi Stachowski Claims He’s Guilty | Radar Online



I always felt that there was more to this guy than the documentary was showing. They tried to make him out as some sweet simpleton. The guy soaked a cat in gasoline and then threw it on a fire. Animal cruelty is an early sign of a psychopath. I think people are jumping on the he's innocent bandwagon way too quickly.

In full disclosure, I haven't watched the full documentary yet and I've heard the investigation was a mess and some of the evidence is questionable. I just have this feeling deep down that there is something wrong with Avery psychologically or there may have been some sort of abuse in his childhood.
The woman is sketchy at best and she did the interview with Nancy Grace. She has zero credibility.
 
The woman is sketchy at best and she did the interview with Nancy Grace. She has zero credibility.
wouldn't she benefit from him being innocent and getting money though being that she'd get child support ? As sketchy as someone who throws a cat on a fire?
 
wouldn't she benefit from him being innocent and getting money though being that she'd get child support ? As sketchy as someone who throws a cat on a fire?
He's in prison. She's getting no money. His $400,000 is gone. Along comes Nancy Grace. Yahtzee!

Hell yeah Avery is a pos for doing that. Makes me hate him. Having said that, I can't let the past sway me in either way when looking at the case that sent him to prison for life.
 
wouldn't she benefit from him being innocent and getting money though being that she'd get child support ? As sketchy as someone who throws a cat on a fire?
I don't think that they had any children.

Throwing a cat in a fire while partying with friends in your early 20's, is cruel yes, but its hardly worth a life sentence.
 
Nancy Grace is annoying as hell, and, seems to have her own anti Avery agenda. I just can't get 100% on this guys side knowing some of the s*** he's done and from what I saw they really made the dude out to be some innocent puppy dog dullard and I just am not buying it right now.
 
I havent watched this and wont, 10 epsidoes???! How much fluff and filler is packed in 10 episodes?
 
I went on a marathon this weekend and couldn't stop watching through it all. There is no doubt that the doc is not unbiased and clearly has an agenda. For that reason I am not going to jump on the innocence bandwagon even though I am thoroughly disgusted with the Wisconsin judicial/law enforcement system in this case.

I believe we haven't heard the end of this story and just like his previous false conviction I think there are still some major holes remaining that leave the opportunity for a bombshell to drop. I am leaning right now that other Avery family members know more than has been made public and I would be the least shocked to find they have something to do with it all.

One thing that doesn't seem to be discussed in all I have seen/read is how Avery's parents deserve applause for sticking all this out over so many years. Everything shown has them working to help, supporting him in court, and traveling far and wide to visit him. I feel terrible for all the emotions they have been put through for so long.
 
I went on a marathon this weekend and couldn't stop watching through it all. There is no doubt that the doc is not unbiased and clearly has an agenda. For that reason I am not going to jump on the innocence bandwagon even though I am thoroughly disgusted with the Wisconsin judicial/law enforcement system in this case.

I believe we haven't heard the end of this story and just like his previous false conviction I think there are still some major holes remaining that leave the opportunity for a bombshell to drop. I am leaning right now that other Avery family members know more than has been made public and I would be the least shocked to find they have something to do with it all.

One thing that doesn't seem to be discussed in all I have seen/read is how Avery's parents deserve applause for sticking all this out over so many years. Everything shown has them working to help, supporting him in court, and traveling far and wide to visit him. I feel terrible for all the emotions they have been put through for so long.
Mom's gonna mom. Dad's gonna dad.
 
Yup.

One other thought I wanted to add. The one piece that is bothering me more than anything else is the call into dispatch made by Andy Colburn requesting to run the plate of Terry Hallbach's RAV4...a couple days PRIOR to it being discovered and after she was noted as missing. He had absolutely no explanation of how that happened and it was significant enough considering the unfolding events that he would remember. As would the dispatcher who took the call and was never brought forth. I'd really like to see that explained.
 
Yup.

One other thought I wanted to add. The one piece that is bothering me more than anything else is the call into dispatch made by Andy Colburn requesting to run the plate of Terry Hallbach's RAV4...a couple days PRIOR to it being discovered and after she was noted as missing. He had absolutely no explanation of how that happened and it was significant enough considering the unfolding events that he would remember. As would the dispatcher who took the call and was never brought forth. I'd really like to see that explained.
I'd also like a rational explanation on how her messages got deleted when her phone was full? I'm skeptical of her brother and Avery's brothers as well as the police and investigators.
 
I'd also like a rational explanation on how her messages got deleted when her phone was full? I'm skeptical of her brother and Avery's brothers as well as the police and investigators.


Exactly. Needless to say there is still enough being hidden that will eventually come out in the wash, hence my prediction that bombshells are still yet to drop on this story. If the Avery clan has more involvement then it should be short order before that info gets out as their relationships a ripe for are fallout tell-all.
 
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Apparently the guy you see pacing the halls of th courthouse doing his radio show is going to come out with an alternate podcast because the documentary glosses over a lot stuff that he believes is important and it is "not how he remembers"
Even still its clear that the PD and the DA had an agenda and it doest really matter to them how to actually go through a real due process.
It doesn't matter if Avery is guilty or not to me any longer, what matter is how f***ed up the police in Wisconsin are.
 
Apparently the guy you see pacing the halls of th courthouse doing his radio show is going to come out with an alternate podcast because the documentary glosses over a lot stuff that he believes is important and it is "not how he remembers"
Even still its clear that the PD and the DA had an agenda and it doest really matter to them how to actually go through a real due process.
It doesn't matter if Avery is guilty or not to me any longer, what matter is how f***ed up the police in Wisconsin are.
Guilty or not, I think he deserves a new trial. The jury should be picked from a different county. The fact that one of the jurors was the father of a Manitiwoc sheriffs deputy is unacceptable in this case. The press conference prior to trial the DA held should have never happened either. He was aware that he was spewing lies, and its clear he was also aware of how important the court of public opinion is in regards to a high profile jury trial. I was disgusted by the end of the documentary.