Keto Diet and Diabetes

JinCA

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I apologize in advance, this is pretty long and not well written :)

I just wanted to share something with those of you who may have been diagnosed with type 2 or know someone who is. I was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes in January of 2017, I had gained a ton of weight, was eating terribly, drinking soda like it was water and just treating my body like crap. Anyway an A1C test measures your average blood sugar for the past 3 months, a normal non diabetic A1C is 5.7 and below, 5.7-6.5 is pre diabetic and then anything above that is considered type 2 diabetic. My A1C was 10 which means my average blood sugar was around 240, generally speaking you want it to be 100 or below.

So my Doctor at the time prescribed all kinds of medications and just said "watch the sugar" and that was it, he didn't have any real advice on life changes that would help, he just said that I'd need to take the medication for the rest of my life and it'd probably need to increase the doses over time.

Anyway the medications made me feel awful and I had to stop one of them right away because it was making my blood sugar drop into the 50's. After going through that I decided to look into some alternative treatments and I saw a ton of people talking about how the Keto diet worked for them so I figured I'd give it a try. Keto for those who don't know is a diet where you eat mostly healthy fat, some protein and keep the carbs really low, like 20 Net carbs per day. Now I'll be honest I probably eat more protein than a typical Keto diet recommends, it's probably more like a keto/atkins thing for me but whatever you want to call it it's working. My blood sugar normalized within a few days and within a month I was off all of the medication and my blood sugar was still normal.

When you are diabetic they recommend you check your blood sugar 3 times a day (at least I was told this) when you wake up, two hours after one of your meals and before bed. My blood sugar was never high after I started this way of eating and my next A1C which was taken 2 months later had already dropped down to 6, every three months I get it checked and it keeps going down, my last A1C was 4.8. I've lost over 160lbs (without any extra exercise) and all of my blood markers have either improved or stayed the same, I had slightly high triglycerides when I was first diagnosed (in the 155 range) but now they are at 55, HDL (good cholesterol) was low but it's now normal and LDL (Bad cholesterol) went down a bit as well but wasn't high to begin with. I've eaten more red meat, eggs, bacon, avocado, grass fed butter, chicken with the skin on it and vegetables in the past year and a half than I probably had in the previous 10 years lol but everything has improved.

All we are ever told is stay away from fat when sugar and carbs are the real problem, hell the ADA tells diabetics to eat things like fruit, pasta, rice and whole grain bread (it's really not any better for you than white bread) it's no wonder modern medicine hasn't made much progress in this area, they keep telling people to eat the things that are making them sick.

I no longer have to check my blood sugar, I've changed Doctors in the time I've been doing this and he says that I'm no longer considered diabetic because it's been over a year since I had an A1C that was in the diabetic range and I haven't been taking medication. I just thought I'd put this up in case anyone else here was going through something similar, it may be worth your time to give this a try, I can't say it'll work for you for sure but it has worked for a lot of people and it's worked for me.

Edit:
Almost forgot to mention I also do intermittent fasting, I only eat or take anything with calories in between 1:00 p.m. and 7:00 p.m. but the combo of keto and IF has really done a lot of good for me and I hope if anyone here gives it a try that it does the same for them as well.
 
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hrudey

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If you had posted this a year ago . . .:bang:

I'm also type 2, have been for close to 20 years. The middle of last year, I had a nasty toe injury (initially stepped on something I guess, it didn't heal up and my doctor sent me to a podiatrist). The podiatry office pretty much scared me straight - I had been pretty good about taking the insulin (since the pills stopped working for me) but my diet was still pretty starchy and pretty much crap, so I still had wild swings in my sugar. I cut the carbs down quite a bit after that, but on an off and on basis.

Later in the year, a woman at work was talking about the keto diet herself - and after hearing about it, it sounded good, but I wasn't ready to try it. I was actually kind of almost on it at times anyhow but finally I decided in January to go ahead and really do it.

I've been on it now for almost 5 months, with the exception of this past Saturday. Saturday, despite being sick, was a celebration day since I stepped on the scale and saw a number starting with a 1 for the first time since... well, the year started with a 1 then. So I went back to Mellow Mushroom, had a calzone and some pretzel bites, had some halo top, and now it's back to the Keto thing.

I also rarely have to take insulin now - I went from 50 ml twice a day to, usually, 20ml if I test and I'm over about 110. I've never really even approached really high numbers on keto, though I still get into the low 100s in mornings from time to time. I also eat a hell of a lot less; weekdays I'll have a breakfast bowl with eggs and cheese and maybe sausage, then celery, cheese and almonds for lunch and usually chicken thighs for dinner. It's freaking awesome.

I'm curious to see how my A1C will be when I go back later this month for a routine visit, but I'm sure it'll be much improved. I also want to see how the cholestrol and other stuff are, since I've stopped taking those pills as well.
 

JinCA

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If you had posted this a year ago . . .:bang:

I'm also type 2, have been for close to 20 years. The middle of last year, I had a nasty toe injury (initially stepped on something I guess, it didn't heal up and my doctor sent me to a podiatrist). The podiatry office pretty much scared me straight - I had been pretty good about taking the insulin (since the pills stopped working for me) but my diet was still pretty starchy and pretty much crap, so I still had wild swings in my sugar. I cut the carbs down quite a bit after that, but on an off and on basis.

Later in the year, a woman at work was talking about the keto diet herself - and after hearing about it, it sounded good, but I wasn't ready to try it. I was actually kind of almost on it at times anyhow but finally I decided in January to go ahead and really do it.

I've been on it now for almost 5 months, with the exception of this past Saturday. Saturday, despite being sick, was a celebration day since I stepped on the scale and saw a number starting with a 1 for the first time since... well, the year started with a 1 then. So I went back to Mellow Mushroom, had a calzone and some pretzel bites, had some halo top, and now it's back to the Keto thing.

I also rarely have to take insulin now - I went from 50 ml twice a day to, usually, 20ml if I test and I'm over about 110. I've never really even approached really high numbers on keto, though I still get into the low 100s in mornings from time to time. I also eat a hell of a lot less; weekdays I'll have a breakfast bowl with eggs and cheese and maybe sausage, then celery, cheese and almonds for lunch and usually chicken thighs for dinner. It's freaking awesome.

I'm curious to see how my A1C will be when I go back later this month for a routine visit, but I'm sure it'll be much improved. I also want to see how the cholestrol and other stuff are, since I've stopped taking those pills as well.
Good luck and I hope things continue to improve with your blood sugar! I know I was worried when I first started because of concerns about fat and heart health and being diabetic means you are even more at risk. It's crazy to see how decades of nutritional advice has been wrong and even counter productive. Yeah we shouldn't eat trans fat but pretty much every other kind of fat is fine.

You are right about this kind of diet though, yeah not eating cookies and baked goods is rough at first and walking into the store and smelling fresh chocolate chip cookies and fresh baked bread is a killer lol but it's easy to just enjoy the smell and not buy them. I have to admit I recently cheated and had 3 mini brownies that totaled about 50 grams of sugar, luckily 2 hours later my blood sugar was already back down to 92. Typically if I do have any kind of treat it's Ghirardelli 86% dark chocolate, it's really low in sugar and t's something I've grown to like, I used to hate dark chocolate but I've learned to like it enough that it makes me feel like I had a treat without wanting to over indulge the way I would with milk chocolate.

When I tell people I eat a lot of steak, bacon, eggs and chicken with the skin and vegetables with grass fed butter their first reaction is "aren't you worried about your cholesterol?" and when I tell them if anything it has gotten better and not worse they are shocked and I don't blame them, I would be too if it weren't happening to me lol.

I have recently started walking 3-4 miles a day 5 days a week and doing some upper body work because the weight loss has slowed a bit but that's bound to happen when you get closer to your goal weight. I also am a little less strict with the carbs which doesn't help, by less strict I mean sometimes hitting 40-50 net carbs instead of 20 but on days that I do go over 20 I make sure to exercise to help work off the excess I've taken in.
 
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Viktor

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Twitch streamer I watch was on keto for quite a while and it helped him. I think he was in it strictly for the weight loss. I've thought about it as well but I'm a lazy eater. Not picky, but just try to eat stuff that takes the absolute bare minimum to cook. I try to keep my calories down but not really sure where I am at on carbs. Should probably try keeping track of that for a while. Anyways, I do need to lose some weight as I've gained slowly for the past year and just over 200. I was pretty lazy last year and then the garbage ski season didn't help me stay active. This spring and eventually through fall I've been biking at least three days a week and at least 10 miles each time. On top of that I've been keeping calories to 1800 a day or even closer to 1500 or less on days that I bike.
 

Videodrome

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I'm not diabetic, but it does run in my family. I got blood work recently and my numbers are okay to decent. I just need to lose weight and I should do more cardio. For now, I just have meds for hypertension and that's under control.

My issue with food is I'm always on the go at work and I don't always get a real lunch break so I often just eat while driving the work truck while pulling g trailers. Sandwiches make this more convenient but.... bread bad? I dunno.

I don't think I could follow the Keto diet, but just generally try to watch carbs. Maybe ditch the bread for lettuce wraps? Just curious what low carb dieters do for basic food on the go. So many diet websites suggest these gourmet recipes with kitchen prep and very specific ingredients. I just want something basic to go in a lunchbox or in a pinch, what is okay at a store or even fast food? Burger and ditch the bun?

For what its worth, I quit getting fries a long time ago. I never get combos. Also as a truck driver, things could be worse.
 

JinCA

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Twitch streamer I watch was on keto for quite a while and it helped him. I think he was in it strictly for the weight loss. I've thought about it as well but I'm a lazy eater. Not picky, but just try to eat stuff that takes the absolute bare minimum to cook. I try to keep my calories down but not really sure where I am at on carbs. Should probably try keeping track of that for a while. Anyways, I do need to lose some weight as I've gained slowly for the past year and just over 200. I was pretty lazy last year and then the garbage ski season didn't help me stay active. This spring and eventually through fall I've been biking at least three days a week and at least 10 miles each time. On top of that I've been keeping calories to 1800 a day or even closer to 1500 or less on days that I bike.
Carbs are more important to watch than calories because unused carbs get stored as fat and your body won't work on burning fat if it has carbs to burn first because it's easier fuel. Calories do matter but not anywhere near as much as carbs/sugar.

I'm lazy too lol, I used to eat fast food all the time but I haven't eaten a meal that I didn't cook since I went on Keto, I grill a lot which isn't hard but if I want something different sometimes I'll make a fake Lasagna but use thinly sliced zucchini instead of noodles or sometimes not even bother with those, if you layer it you really don't miss the noodles at all or I also make some keto "friendly" casserole kinds of things. I know some people have to cut dairy when on keto, I've found that for me it doesn't really have a negative impact, you just want to make sure you count the carbs and keep track of how much you are using.
 
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JinCA

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I'm not diabetic, but it does run in my family. I got blood work recently and my numbers are okay to decent. I just need to lose weight and I should do more cardio. For now, I just have meds for hypertension and that's under control.

My issue with food is I'm always on the go at work and I don't always get a real lunch break so I often just eat while driving the work truck while pulling g trailers. Sandwiches make this more convenient but.... bread bad? I dunno.

I don't think I could follow the Keto diet, but just generally try to watch carbs. Maybe ditch the bread for lettuce wraps? Just curious what low carb dieters do for basic food on the go. So many diet websites suggest these gourmet recipes with kitchen prep and very specific ingredients. I just want something basic to go in a lunchbox or in a pinch, what is okay at a store or even fast food? Burger and ditch the bun?

For what its worth, I quit getting fries a long time ago. I never get combos. Also as a truck driver, things could be worse.
Yeah you could do the lettuce wrap thing instead of bread or just go without the bread or lettuce but things like American cheese have more carbs than real cheese, (American cheese isn't real cheese :) and regular ketchup has more carbs than it's worth IMO. Mayo and mustard generally don't have any carbs but you want to be careful using too much mayo because it has a lot of ingredients that are considered inflammatory like bad oils. I buy a mayo that's made with avocado oil and it tastes the same as any other it just doesn't use canola or vegetable oil.

Good work on cutting out the fries, luckily for me I was already on my way to giving them up simply because nobody cooks them long enough anymore, I hate soggy fries lol.

I'm not a gourmet cook either so everything I make is basic, often times when I see a recipe that I think sounds good I cut out the stuff that I don't already have. I'm not big on a ton of seasonings so it makes it easier and cheaper to just do it my way.
 

Videodrome

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I only use mayo for tuna sandwiches. I usually use German or Dijon mustard for lunchmeat sandwiches. Very rarely use ketchup for anything.

I don't buy generic Kraft cheese if that's what you mean. I like Gouda or Muenster. Sometimes a jalapeno jack cheese.

Main thing though is I only like cooking for dinner. This can include eggs because I work a late shift and sometimes make breakfast dinner when I get home at 3am lol. That sometimes includes eggs with Feta cheese and Hot sauce. Otherwise, keep thinking of basic to-go things. So many meal suggestion sites suggest these fancy meal like steak slices with greens or stuffed peppers. I'm eating regularly in a truck; I don't have table for a sit down meal.
 
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JinCA

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I only use mayo for tuna sandwiches. I usually use German or Dijon mustard for lunchmeat sandwiches. Very rarely use ketchup for anything.

I don't buy generic Kraft cheese if that's what you mean. I like Gouda or Muenster. Sometimes a jalapeno jack cheese.

Main thing though is I only like cooking for dinner. This can include eggs because I work a late shift and sometimes make breakfast dinner when I get home at 3am lol. That sometimes includes eggs with Feta cheese and Hot sauce. Otherwise, keep thinking of basic to-go things. So many meal suggestion sites suggest these fancy meal like steak slices with greens or stuffed peppers. I'm eating regularly in a truck; I don't have table for a sit down meal.
Yeah it's hard in your situation, do you have a small refrigerator or microwave in your cab? sorry I know some of them have big sleeping compartments but I don't know if they include anything else lol.
 

Videodrome

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Yeah it's hard in your situation, do you have a small refrigerator or microwave in your cab? sorry I know some of them have big sleeping compartments but I don't know if they include anything else lol.
I got out of longhaul and drive a tiny yard truck in a local job. I keep trailers moving between the drop lot and the docks so I'm still in the truck all the time, but at least I'm home every day. If we're busy though, I can wind up having no time to get out of the truck for lunch.

I can pack a cooler which I did today with a sandwich, banana, beef jerkey, and granola bar, all of which is convenient hand held food I can munch on while driving. Banana has nutrition, but is starchy carbs. Not sure about the bread for the sandwich or the granola bars(Nature Valley).

I dunno sometimes between my 2 job sites I have time to stop at a convenience store for a coffee refill and they have a lot of hot food to go. Would it fit this type of eating if I grabbed a burger or bratwurst and tossed the bun?

I didn't really want to get into to much of a tangent on my weird job schedule, but I suppose it's an example of how many people have an awkward Work / Life balance and probably why Americans eat out so much.

As for dinner, I was planning to have Hot Wings and Bleu Cheese with a side salad. I guess the chicken skin is fine but some of these probably have a bit of breading? I guess it depends on how they're made including fry oil.
 

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I don't know if it's the same overseas, but here, when something says "99% fat free!" They're generally compensating with obscene amounts of sugar and salts.

I pretty much grew up on a keto/Atkins plan, but that was more because we grew our own food, killed our own chickens, milked our own cows. So even our milk was full fat, without being homogenised or pasteurised.

Then, I moved to the city at 15 and started eating fast food daily, and it really messed with me. I've always been a bad sleeper, but I'd be drinking 'soda' and eating fries on the way to work, and I'd be hyper, then crashing and moody.

My weight never fluctuated as a result, but I noticed that I'd get night sweats if I had subway or Macca's. Looking back now, it was probably the drinks that were messing me up, but I refuse to eat at most fast food places. There are healthier options now, but I still look at the experience with disdain. If I'm going to do something as intimate as eat in front of people, I don't want to be surrounded by people who haven't mastered the art of getting the food in their mouth, or masticating while remaining silent.

I'm a big proponent for fasting too. But not for the same reasons... Starve myself for two days, then I can drink my worries away without feeling guilty the next night.

Anywho, Ive got a silly genetic iron issue, and there's a recommended diet to help prevent escalation in iron levels, but I'd rather eat heaps of meat and give blood more regularly, than to have to live on leafy food.

And kudos to you JinCA, you were confronted with something which is really daunting and scary, and instead of letting it overwhelm you, you managed to conquer it in a large way. You took control of it, even in spite of what initially sounds like a really s*** doctor.

I had this awesome doctor as a child, and he kept saying 'A pinch of prevention is worth a pound of a cure.' he would always insist that medication should be the last resort, but I've been finding most doctors aren't like that anymore. The last two Ive been to for my liver function tests commented that it's working fine, but have still offered me the option of drugs.

With regular phlebotomy visits, my haemochromatosis isn't an issue at all. I don't have to take pills, and someone gets some B- blood.
 

JinCA

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I don't know if it's the same overseas, but here, when something says "99% fat free!" They're generally compensating with obscene amounts of sugar and salts.

I pretty much grew up on a keto/Atkins plan, but that was more because we grew our own food, killed our own chickens, milked our own cows. So even our milk was full fat, without being homogenised or pasteurised.

Then, I moved to the city at 15 and started eating fast food daily, and it really messed with me. I've always been a bad sleeper, but I'd be drinking 'soda' and eating fries on the way to work, and I'd be hyper, then crashing and moody.

My weight never fluctuated as a result, but I noticed that I'd get night sweats if I had subway or Macca's. Looking back now, it was probably the drinks that were messing me up, but I refuse to eat at most fast food places. There are healthier options now, but I still look at the experience with disdain. If I'm going to do something as intimate as eat in front of people, I don't want to be surrounded by people who haven't mastered the art of getting the food in their mouth, or masticating while remaining silent.

I'm a big proponent for fasting too. But not for the same reasons... Starve myself for two days, then I can drink my worries away without feeling guilty the next night.

Anywho, Ive got a silly genetic iron issue, and there's a recommended diet to help prevent escalation in iron levels, but I'd rather eat heaps of meat and give blood more regularly, than to have to live on leafy food.

And kudos to you JinCA, you were confronted with something which is really daunting and scary, and instead of letting it overwhelm you, you managed to conquer it in a large way. You took control of it, even in spite of what initially sounds like a really s*** doctor.

I had this awesome doctor as a child, and he kept saying 'A pinch of prevention is worth a pound of a cure.' he would always insist that medication should be the last resort, but I've been finding most doctors aren't like that anymore. The last two Ive been to for my liver function tests commented that it's working fine, but have still offered me the option of drugs.

With regular phlebotomy visits, my haemochromatosis isn't an issue at all. I don't have to take pills, and someone gets some B- blood.
Yeah most doctors I've had here want to hand out pills like candy, I don't know if they get kickbacks from the drug companies or they just figure the patient won't bother trying to take care of their health anyway. Sadly a lot of people would rather just take a pill and not make any effort to improve their health.

Yeah it's the same here regarding "low fat/fat free" stuff, it's got a lot more sugar in it to make it taste better to make up for the loss of fat.

Thanks for the "kudos" :) BTW.
 

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I try to aviod suger, other than from fruits. For health reason. Thanks for the post.
 
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Yeah most doctors I've had here want to hand out pills like candy, I don't know if they get kickbacks from the drug companies or they just figure the patient won't bother trying to take care of their health anyway. Sadly a lot of people would rather just take a pill and not make any effort to improve their health.

Yeah it's the same here regarding "low fat/fat free" stuff, it's got a lot more sugar in it to make it taste better to make up for the loss of fat.

Thanks for the "kudos" :) BTW.
Anytime, my love. ;)

As far as kickbacks, I'm not sure. I know they get a lot of free stuff locally, to an extent, it just isn't allowed to be cash.

I'm mates with the nurses who do my venipuncture (I took the brochure for the big words. :p) and they told me that companies will supply them with booking software, free messaging/confirmation services, fly them out for 'seminars' to exotic locales, and comp traveling expenses to a rediculous extent.

The next time you're in your doctor's office, and he's typing away before printing off your prescription, watch and see if any ads pop up on his screen.

That seems really shifty to me.

I've had a couple of clients in my salon over the years who are sales reps, and they've warned me not to go to a 'super-clinic' unless I know exactly what I want, or if I just want pills.

One in-particular told me that they give them cases of samples that far exceed the amount that they could actually require in a fortnight.

Also, quasi unrelated, but the Crossfit dude who recently got fired for slagging off the gays posted this story which I found interesting.

The sheila is type-2 diabetic aswell, and talks about losing weight... But then it turns into the crazy Crossfit cult talk. (I swear, Crossfit is the sleeper cell of Scientology)
 

Plainview

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It's interesting reading your guys stories. I don't have it, but I had to deal with it, but not with a human. My cat's levels got insanely high. His levels were clocking in at 400. He wasn't eating much. Most doctors are "start insulin now and keep doing it forever." Luckily, at my vet at the time, I had a vet look at him and he was a holistic doctor. The head doctor in the practice isn't and would have thrown him on insulin immediately. This doc suggest a food change. No more dry food. Only wet food and the wet food had to be gluten free. Most cat food s loaded with gluten and fillers. He also pointed me to a website about how to treat cats with diabetes. It's protocol is to get all cats off insulin, or, even better, to never have to use it. Most vets set a level of insulin to inject. The protocol has specific numbers to follow and how much insulin to give to ease of reliance on it.

During the food change I had to test his blood before and after eating. To do it for a cat you have to hit the edge of their ears. To say the least it wasn't easy, but I had to do it. Every day it would be pretty much the same. The vet said give it a few weeks. After a few weeks, still, no change. He was eating better, but his numbers were still poor. A couple of weeks later, still, no dice. The vet still didn't want to do insulin. He said give it one more week. Three days later his numbers ending up being in the mid 200's. I was surprised. I took it a little while later. Same number. The next day, low 200's. Two days later, mid 100's. Two days later he hit under 100!

It was amazing. He was in line for a very tough life. It wouldn't have been easy for me as insulin would need to be given with every meal. I continued to test his blood every day for two months and his numbers were great. He ended up living for more than 10 years after the diagnosis. I was so happy for him. He was a tough little guy and fought through it. I'm tearing up now thinking about how and amazing little guy he was.
 

hrudey

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My issue with food is I'm always on the go at work and I don't always get a real lunch break so I often just eat while driving the work truck while pulling g trailers. Sandwiches make this more convenient but.... bread bad? I dunno.

I don't think I could follow the Keto diet, but just generally try to watch carbs. Maybe ditch the bread for lettuce wraps? Just curious what low carb dieters do for basic food on the go. So many diet websites suggest these gourmet recipes with kitchen prep and very specific ingredients. I just want something basic to go in a lunchbox or in a pinch, what is okay at a store or even fast food? Burger and ditch the bun?
Yeah, when I get a burger I get it with a lettuce wrap or just without the bun. I know Five Guys does a lettuce wrap and it's even an option in their online ordering, and when we grill them at home usually either wrap it if we have fresh lettuce or just eat it plain. The thing with me is that starches really cause my blood sugar to go out of whack; for a while I was trying to manage the diabetes by switching to purely grain bread, brown rice, grainier pasta, etc. I could actually handle actual sweets better because it'd spike up a bit and then be gone, but eating a bowl of rice would cause it to go up and stay up for hours.

One thing that's maybe not a meal but a good snack is keto bars - I've ordered them from www.ketobars.com and been very happy with them. If you have a way of keeping it cool, cheese is another good thing to throw in a meal; celery, cheese and almonds is my go-to lunch during the week, and it doesn't take up much space at all.

The main thing with food on the go is that carbs are hiding everywhere. Driving through places is very difficult - Hardees/Carls Jr. does do low carb bowls, you can get bunless burgers, and Chick-fil-A does grilled chicken nuggets, but I got in the habit of trying to check nutrition info before eating anything new.
 
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Viktor

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My normal day consists of coffee in the morning which keeps me full until about 10:30 or so when I have a breakfast/protein bar. I have one now I grabbed that was low cal but 13g net car so seems pretty high. Lunch usually not until 1:30-2 range and is salad which I go over below, and then dinner is kind of all over the place but again at least right now trying for low cal. Will have to check out the carb situation and come up with a few meal options. I can eat the same thing over and over without getting sick of it so even if I had like three or four different meals I would be set. Dinner usually not until 7 so I'm fairly close to that 8 hour window or whatever for intermittent fasting. Maybe not exactly within the 8 hours but close enough for now.

Was looking on Amazon for keto friendly bars for my late breakfast and they mention Quest bars. I tried the blueberry ones once and thought it tasted like trash. Maybe it was just that flavor/variety so I'll have to look into it. Either way net carbs are like 5g on those so a lot better than what I'm eating now. Those Keto Bars look like the best option though to get tons of fat for the day.

I usually eat salad for lunch, at least 4 days during the work week. I'm in a small town for work with only a Subway so it's usually that. Just doing their nutrition calculator the salad I get is pretty good low-carb wise. Lettuce, spinach, tomatoes, cucumbers, black olives, onions, chicken, and usually the vinaigrette. That is 10g net carbs although only 11g of fat as well. Avocado is supposed to be good for keto though right? Only adds 1g to net carb and 5g to fat. Can't remember if this Subway has it but either way seems like a decent low cal/carb lunch. Maybe start buying some type of nuts as a snack in the afternoon.

My goal right now is only 10-15lbs so even if I don't get to that sweet spot of what 20g of net carbs a day, if I can cut it to half of recommended daily requirements I'm doing better. Just going off what I normally eat every day for breakfast and lunch I can cut it down to 15g for two meals. Not bad for starters I guess.
 

Plainview

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My normal day consists of coffee in the morning which keeps me full until about 10:30 or so when I have a breakfast/protein bar. I have one now I grabbed that was low cal but 13g net car so seems pretty high. Lunch usually not until 1:30-2 range and is salad which I go over below, and then dinner is kind of all over the place but again at least right now trying for low cal. Will have to check out the carb situation and come up with a few meal options. I can eat the same thing over and over without getting sick of it so even if I had like three or four different meals I would be set. Dinner usually not until 7 so I'm fairly close to that 8 hour window or whatever for intermittent fasting. Maybe not exactly within the 8 hours but close enough for now.

Was looking on Amazon for keto friendly bars for my late breakfast and they mention Quest bars. I tried the blueberry ones once and thought it tasted like trash. Maybe it was just that flavor/variety so I'll have to look into it. Either way net carbs are like 5g on those so a lot better than what I'm eating now. Those Keto Bars look like the best option though to get tons of fat for the day.

I usually eat salad for lunch, at least 4 days during the work week. I'm in a small town for work with only a Subway so it's usually that. Just doing their nutrition calculator the salad I get is pretty good low-carb wise. Lettuce, spinach, tomatoes, cucumbers, black olives, onions, chicken, and usually the vinaigrette. That is 10g net carbs although only 11g of fat as well. Avocado is supposed to be good for keto though right? Only adds 1g to net carb and 5g to fat. Can't remember if this Subway has it but either way seems like a decent low cal/carb lunch. Maybe start buying some type of nuts as a snack in the afternoon.

My goal right now is only 10-15lbs so even if I don't get to that sweet spot of what 20g of net carbs a day, if I can cut it to half of recommended daily requirements I'm doing better. Just going off what I normally eat every day for breakfast and lunch I can cut it down to 15g for two meals. Not bad for starters I guess.
Keep in mind, everyone, you need carbs. Everyone does. Brain function drops dramatically without them, as well as mood swings, depression, etc. Not to mention muscle loss. Also, if you're like me, I have a skip beat in my heart. It's not an actual skip, but two quick beats and a pause, and lower carbs increases frequency exponentially. I do like the fact you used the term "net carbs." Most people don't think that way.
 
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JinCA

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Keep in mind, everyone, you need carbs. Everyone does. Brain function drops dramatically without them, as well as mood swings, depression, etc. Not to mention muscle loss. Also, if you're like me, I have a skip beat in my heart. It's not an actual skip, but two quick beats and a pause, and lower carbs increases frequency exponentially. I do like the fact you used the term "net carbs." Most people don't think that way.
Yeah net carbs for people who don't know is subtracting the amount of fiber in a product from the total carbs, what you have left is net carbs.

From everything I've read though there aren't any essential carbs like their are protein and fats. I do think for someone who is very active and is looking to build muscle that eating a bit more carbs is a good idea, the goal a low carb diet is to get your body used to burning stored fat for energy instead of the carbs that are easy fuel. If you work out hard you could end up having your body switch to burning muscle instead of fat.
 

Plainview

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Yeah net carbs for people who don't know is subtracting the amount of fiber in a product from the total carbs, what you have left is net carbs.

From everything I've read though there aren't any essential carbs like their are protein and fats. I do think for someone who is very active and is looking to build muscle that eating a bit more carbs is a good idea, the goal a low carb diet is to get your body used to burning stored fat for energy instead of the carbs that are easy fuel. If you work out hard you could end up having your body switch to burning muscle instead of fat.
Muscle loss is huge when cutting carbs. That's why it's not possible to cut fat and build muscle except for newbie trainers. This is really the time where the scale is actually useful. If you're cutting fat, but trying to maintain muscle mass, if you look better in the mirror, but the weight stays constant, you're retaining your muscle. If the scale starts dropping, you're losing muscle. There's nearly no way to prevent any muscle loss. The goal is to keep it at a minimal. That's where carb optimization comes in.
 

Videodrome

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Keep in mind, everyone, you need carbs. Everyone does. Brain function drops dramatically without them, as well as mood swings, depression, etc. Not to mention muscle loss. Also, if you're like me, I have a skip beat in my heart. It's not an actual skip, but two quick beats and a pause, and lower carbs increases frequency exponentially. I do like the fact you used the term "net carbs." Most people don't think that way.
okay what if Keto really just works incidentally by having meat and tossing worthless Carbs/Calories like White Bread, buns, and bagels. Basically, just cutout all bread and just have meat and veggies?
 

JinCA

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okay what if Keto really just works incidentally by having meat and tossing worthless Carbs/Calories like White Bread, buns, and bagels. Basically, just cutout all bread and just have meat and veggies?
Basically what it does is gets rid of most processed fake foods so it probably is more about going to things you'd mostly eat in nature. Then again there are things you shouldn't eat like most fruits, rice and grains. It's sad that diabetics especially have been told to eat fruit, a lot of whole grains, rice, pasta's etc. That's exactly the kind of thing their body is having a problem processing.
 

JinCA

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Muscle loss is huge when cutting carbs. That's why it's not possible to cut fat and build muscle except for newbie trainers. This is really the time where the scale is actually useful. If you're cutting fat, but trying to maintain muscle mass, if you look better in the mirror, but the weight stays constant, you're retaining your muscle. If the scale starts dropping, you're losing muscle. There's nearly no way to prevent any muscle loss. The goal is to keep it at a minimal. That's where carb optimization comes in.
That's the difference though, if you are trying to build muscle it's one thing but if your goal is to lose weight and maintain muscle that's another story. Also I'd have to disagree with you on the mental clarity and mood swings. Most people I know who've done it and info I've read on it suggest the opposite. They tend to have increased mental clarity when in ketosis, it's cleaner fuel than carbs/sugar. Most ill effects from going into ketosis are experienced very early on when your body is first making the change.

I know for me I wasn't very active for a while so even though I'm eating very low carb I'm still building some muscle since I started working out, of course I also eat a bit more protein than a strict keto diet so that's likely being converted when I work out instead of it just being strictly fat. Really it all depends on the persons goals and how their body reacts to what they are doing.
 

Videodrome

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What if Plainview is right about the Carbs, but if you follow the diet strictly enough, the Ketones in your system offset this? So you both might be right.

I wonder if brand new low carb dieters have a brain fog phase before ketosis kicks in?
 

Videodrome

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Okay WTF. I still have a loaf of Whole Grain bread to open from the last time I bought groceries. I'm even having some Whole Grain for toast as I type this. At the time, I was debating whether sandwiches should be how I prepare my To-Go Lunches for work.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/why-is-bread-bad-for-you#section1

Bread Is High in Carbs and Can Spike Blood Sugar Levels

It has been known for a long time that white bread and refined grains in general aren't particularly nutritious.
Nutritionists and dietitians all around the world have encouraged us to eat whole grains instead.
But grains, especially gluten grains like wheat, have been under intense scrutiny in recent years.
Many respected health professionals now claim that bread and other sources of gluten grains are unnecessary at best and potentially harmful.


Even whole grain bread usually isn't made with actual "whole" grains.
They are grains that have been pulverized into very fine flour. Even though this process reserves the nutrients, it causes these products to be digested rapidly.
The starches in bread get broken down quickly in the digestive tract and enter the bloodstream as glucose. This causes a rapid spike in blood sugar and insulin levels.
Even whole wheat bread spikes blood sugar faster than many candy bars (1).
When blood sugar goes up rapidly, it tends to go down just as quickly. When blood sugar goes down, we become hungry.
This is the blood sugar roller coaster that is familiar to people on high carb diets. Soon after eating, they become hungry again, which calls for another high-carb snack.
Elevated blood sugars can also cause glycation at the cellular level when the blood sugars react with proteins in the body. This is one of the components of ageing (2).
Studies on carb restricted diets (which eliminate/reduce starches and sugars) suggest that individuals who are diabetic or need to lose weight should avoid all grains

Bread Contains a Lot of Gluten

Wheat contains a large amount of a protein called gluten.
This protein has glue-like properties (hence the name glu-ten) responsible for dough's viscoelastic properties.
Evidence is mounting that a significant percentage of the population is sensitive to gluten (6, 7, 8).
When we eat bread that contains gluten (wheat, spelt, rye and barley), the immune system in our digestive tract "attacks" the gluten proteins (9).
Controlled trials in people without celiac disease show that gluten damages the wall of the digestive tract, causing pain, bloating, stool inconsistency and tiredness (10, 11).
Gluten sensitivity is also associated with some cases of schizophrenia (12, 13) and cerebellar ataxia (14, 15) - both serious disorders of the brain.
Gluten is probably harmful for most people, not just those with diagnosed celiac disease or gluten sensitivity.
The only way to really know if you're gluten sensitive is to remove gluten from your diet for 30 days and then reintroduce it and see whether it affects you.

----------------------------------------------------


I guess this is a part of the story of American Franken-Food. Should I throw my Wheat Bread in the trash lol ?

At this point, I'm almost thinking of just snacking at work from some Mini-Peppers and Lunchmeat and maybe a few cheese sticks or Celery dipped in Peanutbutter in a cooler. Possibly include a meal replacement shake dealy if the ingredients seem legit. At the same time, I don't want to make up a meal plan that is so lean I get hunger and wind up at the work vending machine or grabbing something extra from the convenience store between my two job sites.
 

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Videodrome

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Apparently, Guacamole is Keto / Low Carb friendly. Is there a suggested Keto substitute for Chips?

Hmmm..... maybe this is something Pork Rinds would be good for. They're rather bland on their own after a while. Maybe they just need some Guac.
 

hrudey

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Apparently, Guacamole is Keto / Low Carb friendly. Is there a suggested Keto substitute for Chips?

Hmmm..... maybe this is something Pork Rinds would be good for. They're rather bland on their own after a while. Maybe they just need some Guac.
I've used pork rinds for homemade nachos, too. I don't like avocado so I can't attest to that combo, though.