The Naughty Dog Agenda

yankeessuck said:
Nobody is losing their constitutional free speech because Resetera is banning people
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Thanks for the news flash. I was explaining why I found the practice and the ideology behind it disgusting. If a game forum wants to embrace that ideology and ban certain opinions and types of speech, that's their perogative. I just won't be a part of it.

Kerosene31 said:
That means that even some awful people get to speak too. That's the cost of free speech.
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Yup. Free speech means nothing if it doesn't include speech you find offensive.
 
Andy said:
Thanks for the news flash. I was explaining why I found the practice and the ideology behind it disgusting. If a game forum wants to embrace that ideology and ban certain opinions and types of speech, that's their perogative. I just won't be a part of it.
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Exactly its their prerogative and that sounds like a good reason not to post there but its not a free speech issue. Your free speech has not been eating away one bit.
 
yankeessuck said:
Exactly its their prerogative and that sounds like a good reason not to post there but its not a free speech issue. Your free speech has not been eating away one bit.
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The ideology behind it is absolutely a free speech issue. I don't particularly care about Resetera per se -- it's just a f*cking gaming forum and has little or no meaning or impact on anything --- but I do I care about the issue itself. If I smell that sort of nonsense, I'm out.
 
Andy said:
The ideology behind it is absolutely a free speech issue. I don't particularly care about Resetera per se -- it's just a f*cking gaming forum and has little or no meaning or impact on anything --- but I do I care about the issue itself. If I smell that sort of nonsense, I'm out.
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Free speech on the site issue yeah. Free speech in the country issue? Not even the tiniest bit.

Freedom of speech is about you being able to say what you want. It doesn't mean anyone has to listen.
 
yankeessuck said:
Free speech on the site issue yeah. Free speech in the country issue? Not even the tiniest bit.

Freedom of speech is about you being able to say what you want. It doesn't mean anyone has to listen.
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Not sure what you're trying to say.
 
I think he's saying that free speech is covered as a right meaning you can't be arrested (for the most part) for saying something but a website can police speech if it wants to. It's a private entity and you agree to certain terms before they even approve of you being able to "speak" there at all. I'm sure you know all of that so I'm not trying to educate you on anything but I think that's what he's saying. Oh I wish we had total free speech, I've had a few bosses I would have loved to share a few choice words with but I didn't because I knew I'd get fired. The boldest thing I ever did say was that I could change the fact that I worked there faster than she could because I didn't need to go through human resources first lol.
 
Freedom of Speech gets thrown around by Americans so much, it's like an obsession.

The majority of the time, it's used while they're trying to diminish the voice of others.
 
Bellybama said:
Freedom of Speech gets thrown around by Americans so much, it's like an obsession.

The majority of the time, it's used while they're trying to diminish the voice of others.
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As others have said we have to defend unpopular speech if we really believe in free speech, one day there could be someone in power who doesn't like what we have to say and we have to make sure that we don't set the precedent that it's ok to lawfully silence someone with an opposing view because someone could turn around and do that to us.. It's one thing to tell someone to shut up, it's not like they have to do it but when you start treating free speech as "no big deal" there are plenty of forces who would love to have the power to take that right away.
 
JinCA said:
As others have said we have to defend unpopular speech if we really believe in free speech, one day there could be someone in power who doesn't like what we have to say and we have to make sure that we don't set the precedent that it's ok to lawfully silence someone with an opposing view because someone could turn around and do that to us.. It's one thing to tell someone to shut up, it's not like they have to do it but when you start treating free speech as "no big deal" there are plenty of forces who would love to have the power to take that right away.
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But no one is preventing them from voicing their opinion, they're just changing the modus operandi of the outcome.

If they got banned from a forum, they can still say whatever they want, it will just be to a different audience.

Freedom of speech is spouted continuously. Freedom, freedom, freedom. It's zealous, and super crazy for a country that is so restrictive.

The platform that you're using doesn't have to support you. Your voice isn't effected.

If I came on here with overtly racist ideals, and continued to spout offensive, degrading, or upsetting values, would my "freedom of speech" be as important?

If I think someone is a c***, does freedom of speech enable me to continuously spew forth venomous diatribes?

Moderating a forum is on itself a direct opposition of freedom of speech.

I understand where you're coming from, but it's a bit hypocritical to say "we must protect this at all costs!!!... But not this, this and this..."
 
If a person gets banned for saying how one feels... that IS preventing them from voicing the their opinion.
So not everyone has freedom of speech.

Racism is wrong but people who are not down with agreeing with LBGT things shouldn't be compared to them as they are different issues.

LBGT have issue with people who don't agree with their views and don't accept those lifestyles as normal.
Lets not try and spin that away.


Not agreeing with homosexual lifestyles doesn't make a person a hater or wrong.
Doing mean things to homosexuals makes one a hater and wrong.
 
VaLLiancE said:
If a person gets banned for saying how one feels... that IS preventing them from voicing the their opinion.
So not everyone has freedom of speech.

Racism is wrong but people who are not down with agreeing with LBGT things shouldn't be compared to them as they are different issues.

LBGT have issue with people who don't agree with their views and don't accept those lifestyles as normal.
Lets not try and spin that away.


Not agreeing with homosexual lifestyles doesn't make a person a hater or wrong.
Doing mean things to homosexuals makes one a hater and wrong.
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Once again it's not a "lifestyle" it's the way people are, the reason some use the comparison is you are looking down on an entire group of people who are different than you which is what the definition of racism is (thinking one race is superior to another) and many people who feel the way you do actually go out of their way to try to prevent gay people from having the same rights you have. Hating on someone for their skin color which they had no choice in is basically the same as hating them for their sexuality, it's just not as easy to understand because it's part of who someone is and not just what you see on the outside, both are wrong.
 
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Bellybama said:
But no one is preventing them from voicing their opinion, they're just changing the modus operandi of the outcome.

If they got banned from a forum, they can still say whatever they want, it will just be to a different audience.

Freedom of speech is spouted continuously. Freedom, freedom, freedom. It's zealous, and super crazy for a country that is so restrictive.

The platform that you're using doesn't have to support you. Your voice isn't effected.

If I came on here with overtly racist ideals, and continued to spout offensive, degrading, or upsetting values, would my "freedom of speech" be as important?

If I think someone is a c***, does freedom of speech enable me to continuously spew forth venomous diatribes?

Moderating a forum is on itself a direct opposition of freedom of speech.

I understand where you're coming from, but it's a bit hypocritical to say "we must protect this at all costs!!!... But not this, this and this..."
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Freedom of speech means you won't face legal issues from saying what you want to say it doesn't mean you can say whatever you want on someone else's private property without being asked to leave, same thing with being banned on a forum where you actually have to be approved before you are allowed to "speak" at all. My reply to your post wasn't about posting on forums though, that post of yours was about free speech in general or at least it seemed like it. Personally I think people who are only trying to cause problems on forums should be banned because again they agreed to follow certain guidelines before they were allowed to participate on the site but if you are simply making a point the way Andy did on Resetera and was labeled a misogynist for it that's idiocy.
 
JinCA said:
Once again it's not a "lifestyle" it's the way people are, the reason some use the comparison is you are looking down on an entire group of people who are different than you which is what the definition of racism is (thinking one race is superior to another) and many people who feel the way you do actually go out of their way to try to prevent gay people from having the same rights you have. Hating on someone for their skin color which they had no choice in is basically the same as hating them for their sexuality, it's just not as easy to understand because it's part of who someone is and not just what you see on the outside, both are wrong.
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Don't agree
 
VaLLiancE said:
If a person gets banned for saying how one feels... that IS preventing them from voicing the their opinion.
So not everyone has freedom of speech.

Racism is wrong but people who are not down with agreeing with LBGT things shouldn't be compared to them as they are different issues.

LBGT have issue with people who don't agree with their views and don't accept those lifestyles as normal.
Lets not try and spin that away.


Not agreeing with homosexual lifestyles doesn't make a person a hater or wrong.
Doing mean things to homosexuals makes one a hater and wrong.
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I agree with a bunch of this post.

They are seperate issues, but they still all fall under the blanket of prejudice.

Banning people doesn't stop someone's voice, it just changes where they can express it.

Freedom is an absolute. It has no shades. You are either free, or not.

You can't campaign for "f*** yeah! Freedom!" For the issues that are only important to you, without opening up a plethora of things that aren't agreeable.

In this thread, I actually think people were comming down on you hard Val. That was your viewpoint, and I accept that. I'm never going to convert you to a different mindset. And God gave me the strength to accept things that I can't change, and the wisdom to recognise it.

I'd never try to stop your voice (unless it something super offensive... Like black shoes with a brown belt). Because when you express your opinion, you have tact. You reserve a bunch of stuff that you could say and that is faboosh. You hate/angry/dislike my posts, but at least you own up to disagreeing.

i love your posts dude, and I think if you looked close, our morals would be similar, but our ethics would be the difference.

A bunch of people expressing different viewpoints without trying to make other people feel like s***, is the point.

What people who were banned should be asking is, "was my voice at the expense, or with the intent of suppressing others?"

realistically, if you arent projecting a bunch of s***, noone cares.
 
JinCA said:
I think he's saying that free speech is covered as a right meaning you can't be arrested (for the most part) for saying something but a website can police speech if it wants to. It's a private entity and you agree to certain terms before they even approve of you being able to "speak" there at all. I'm sure you know all of that so I'm not trying to educate you on anything but I think that's what he's saying. Oh I wish we had total free speech, I've had a few bosses I would have loved to share a few choice words with but I didn't because I knew I'd get fired. The boldest thing I ever did say was that I could change the fact that I worked there faster than she could because I didn't need to go through human resources first lol.
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free_speech.png
 
JinCA said:
I think he's saying that free speech is covered as a right meaning you can't be arrested (for the most part) for saying something but a website can police speech if it wants to.
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Oh, I understand that. That's pretty obvious to anyone, I would think. (Which is why I basically responded 'duh' the first time and acknowledged it. My point was that the ideology behind SJW stuff is a threat to free speech, and that is why I find it repellant -- well, that's one of several reasons.)

Well, it's the weekend, and it's time to relax and have fun, so I'm going to move on to other subjects. I feel like this topic is occupying too much of my brain pan lately (not just here of course, but in general). Besides, it's more fun to laugh at SJWs than take them seriously.
 
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VaLLiancE said:
Don't agree
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That of course is your right but you are wrong, if you refuse to listen to someone who has actual knowledge vs some preconceived idea of what something is that's on you.
 
VaLLiancE said:
???????

Hes been telling me I am wrong and I am telling him hes wrong pretty simple.
He says its not a choice and I don't agree.
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But you haven't substantiated your opinion (from what I can see) with any evidence. It's just a "well I don't agree" argument from you. Do better.
 
VaLLiancE said:
I am sure somebody reading some of what I posted has a idea of where I am getting my opinion from.
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Le Bible -- or a couple of verses, anyhow, mostly some stuff from the OT and a couple lines from Paul. Jesus himself never said a word about it (you'd think he would've called it out, if it were a big deal).

Btw, I learned recently that "homosexuality" back in Biblical times looked a bit different than it does now. Now when we think of being gay, we picture two men or women together, but back then, what "homosexuality" often meant was an older Roman official banging a young boy who he kept, basically as a sexual slave. That is probably part of why it got a bad name.

Then there's the whole "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve" angle, but apparently God made a lot of gay sheep and rabbits, so that kind of goes out the window.
 
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