Official Thread Destiny 2 - Final Shape
- Thread starter TeKPhaN
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I hate agreeing with Val on anything. Usually when he's right his trolling just accidentally stumbles on the truth. Peer to peer is better than Halo 5's online performance for most regions in the world. Microsoft uses dedicated servers but everyone is routed to a handful of servers. People who live by the servers have major ping advantages and it has more impact than any peer to peer situation I can compare to. It's made worse by the fact that their net code doesn't compensate for ping advantage like many other shooters.
I've played over 1000 hours of Arena and Deathmatch on Halo 5 because I love the freaking gameplay but the performance makes the game nearly unplayable most of the time. Based on the forums, I'm not the only one. Outside of a few major markets, performance is trash for most regions.
Dedicated servers are a buzz word and don't always equal better results. Net code is more important than dedicated servers as ping disparity will happen regardless and it's up to the developers to code to compensate for it. I would take peer to peer with great net code over what 343 has implemented any day of the week.
Bungie's peer to peer on Xbox 360 was better than anything 343 has done this generation on dedicated servers so despite my lack of experience playing Destiny, it's not hard to believe Destiny still performs better online than Halo 5.
I've played over 1000 hours of Arena and Deathmatch on Halo 5 because I love the freaking gameplay but the performance makes the game nearly unplayable most of the time. Based on the forums, I'm not the only one. Outside of a few major markets, performance is trash for most regions.
Dedicated servers are a buzz word and don't always equal better results. Net code is more important than dedicated servers as ping disparity will happen regardless and it's up to the developers to code to compensate for it. I would take peer to peer with great net code over what 343 has implemented any day of the week.
Bungie's peer to peer on Xbox 360 was better than anything 343 has done this generation on dedicated servers so despite my lack of experience playing Destiny, it's not hard to believe Destiny still performs better online than Halo 5.
Oddly enough it's the most popular online since Halo 3 with 10 million+ copies sold.Meanwhile MP in Halo......
I will say...Halo 5s multiplayer is reason to own a Xbox alone. Would still take Bungies old peer to peer and net code though.
Never played Destiny aside from the beta years back.
Didn't think the game looked that great.
So what's so complex in the game making it CPU-intensive sucking up processing power?
Maybe I'm wrong, but I remember the game as
- 30 fps
- Pretty linear
- No destruction, or so little it didn't really show
- Dumb as rocks AI
Didn't think the game looked that great.
So what's so complex in the game making it CPU-intensive sucking up processing power?
Maybe I'm wrong, but I remember the game as
- 30 fps
- Pretty linear
- No destruction, or so little it didn't really show
- Dumb as rocks AI
I guess I didn't consider the game linear. I saw it as a bit open world, though not GTAV open world.
It probably has a lot more to do with the engine than the console warz stuff.
It has been reported many times that the engine is tough to work with, and it makes sense that Bungie has not had a ton of time to update it.
It has been reported many times that the engine is tough to work with, and it makes sense that Bungie has not had a ton of time to update it.
Digital Foundry video discussing the game while showing standard PS4 footage, they talk about the console/PC framerate difference (skip ahead to 6:40) and how even the Pro/Scorpio CPU's aren't going to be enough for it to be 60 fps. They also mention that the PC version that was running 60 fps at the event they attended had a CPU that was much more powerful than the ones in the Pro/Scorpio.
They also discuss the dedicated servers vs client based and they seem to be wanting dedicated servers at least for the PC because of hacking issues and mention that they maybe could have used dedicated servers for consoles to offload some CPU tasks to get the framerates up to 60 fps.
They also discuss the dedicated servers vs client based and they seem to be wanting dedicated servers at least for the PC because of hacking issues and mention that they maybe could have used dedicated servers for consoles to offload some CPU tasks to get the framerates up to 60 fps.
They could do it at 60fps on Scorpio. Without a doubt. Marketing deals and what not though. The evil Sony empire strikes again.
They don't sound certain what the Scorpio can do.
From what I can tell, the Scorpio's CPU is not the lackluster version SONY dumped onto the Playstation Pro. Microsoft targeted all the bottlenecks in their original XBOX ONE.
And from how amazing the FORZA code translated over to an unoptimized devkit running unoptimized game code, I expect Scorpio could run the game at 60fps unless the programmers were incompetent.
Richard is the guy who got all the info on Scorpio, he knows more than anyone on here what it can and can't do and he's the guy in the video who says that the cpu's aren't strong enough to double the frame rate from 30 to 60 and being that they are both customized jaguars that makes sense. Keep believing the hype from MS all you want but you can't turn a Hyundai into a Ferrari, you can make it the best Hyundai it can be to fit your particular set of needs but it's still going to be a Hyundai. For the record the CPU in the Pro is customized as well, it's based on the one in the PS4 which was customized and even at a lower clock speed was more capable overall than the one in the X1.
As far as the programmers it's not them being incompetent it's the choices they make. It's easy to look at a game like this vs something like BF1 which looks better and runs faster (steady 60 fps on Pro) and think that Bungie must suck. Their engine clearly isn't working the same way as frostbite or else the games would be 60 fps on Pro and Scorpio and be targeting that for the standard consoles as well but that's just not how their tech works. It's obviously more CPU dependent than the games that are targeting 60 fps are, why they haven't switched to something else I don't know but maybe it's just what they are more comfortable using.
It would serve people well to remember that these are consoles and not high end PC's, MS and Sony have to make sacrifices due to cost, heat and power consumption. Someone with a lot of extra cash burning a hole in their pocket who wants a gaming rig wouldn't even consider putting the CPU that these consoles have in their machine. That's fine though because the CPU is the best place to cut costs, better a weaker cpu than a weaker GPU or less memory.
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Knowing about specs and understanding what that means to programming are completely different things. The Playstation 4 Pro was lazily designed as a modest improvement. I have said it was an answer for the developers who complained the Playstation 4 was not adequately powered for VR games. From the coverage I've seen on the Scorpio, there was a serious redesign effort to maximize the power of the system that went across the board.
I don't see Bungie as cutting edge developers. They are fine, but they aren't top contenders. Watching the gameplay for Destiny 2 really didn't impress. They said they updated parts of the engine, but it didn't show up strong.
When evaluating hardware, never compare consoles directly with PC specs, because it's a fool's errand. PCs have alot of overhead with the operating systems and it's a wild west situation with hardware and software. Consoles are built specifically for games and decisions made are to optimize the hardware and software to squeeze more out of them.
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Yes PC's have a lot of overhead you are right, the thing is people were calling the CPU's in the X1/PS4 outdated 4 years ago when the consoles were announced (damn has it been that long already? lol) upping the clock a bit and doing more customization will help you get a little more mileage out of it but it's not going to perform like something newer and much more powerful.
The focus of these consoles was to try to be able to hit 4K or "faux K" it wasn't to run games at 60 fps, the big gains are in the GPU's and in Scorpios case with some extra memory, the CPU's in both consoles will still be limiting factors but again consoles need a balance of price, convenience and performance and we can't have it all in a $399 box. I totally disagree with the Pro being about VR and it has never been marketed that way, all PSVR games shown before the Pro launched were on standard PS4's and that's where most of them are still played.
As far as Bungie they never have been a cutting edge studio, the most impressed with a game of theirs I have ever been was with the first Halo and that was because the textures and lighting looked like a pretty big step up from the consoles on the market at the time. Bungie (along with just about every other MS 1st party not named turn 10) never did push the hardware the way the top 3rd party devs do.
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They could do it 60fps on Both... Hoping they keep getting chit and make modes available.
Becausethey are only free for xbox. You have to pay to use them on on PS4...not sure bout PC.
