No argument there. His misunderstanding is firmly rooted in the steaming pile of crap that was our messaging... But his understanding is (nevertheless) false.
Rumour - PS4 performance boost (vs. X1, DX12, etc.)
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No argument there. His misunderstanding is firmly rooted in the steaming pile of crap that was our messaging... But his understanding is (nevertheless) false.
Another derailed tech thread full of mud slinging. Oh well.
The hardware isn't changing so learn more about PS4's hardware if you want to figure out where performance boosts might come from.
The hardware isn't changing so learn more about PS4's hardware if you want to figure out where performance boosts might come from.
The simple reality is both console will see improvement, & the gain in performance will most likely be similar. At the ned of the day, both using CPU/GPU from the same company.
Most rational posters already know these, & have been saying this. Just because Sony did not keep talking about the improvement, doesn't mean they are no meaningful improvement, or they lay off all their tools programmers after PS4 launched.
To be fair MS also didn't bragging about performance enhancements also, & when they mention, they are fairly conservativem using words, like "there will be perfomane gain". Its some internet posters that overblown every tech & upcoming tools in X1, like the 2nd coming of Spice girls.
Most rational posters already know these, & have been saying this. Just because Sony did not keep talking about the improvement, doesn't mean they are no meaningful improvement, or they lay off all their tools programmers after PS4 launched.
To be fair MS also didn't bragging about performance enhancements also, & when they mention, they are fairly conservativem using words, like "there will be perfomane gain". Its some internet posters that overblown every tech & upcoming tools in X1, like the 2nd coming of Spice girls.
If I recall correctly, all the debate over improvements started from a developer comment stating that the development tools were a little behind, and that updates to them yielded great results. In the current climate of resolutions and frame-rates it got the caustic response from one set of folk, and lauded by another set. Then came all the DX12 nonsense with one group reaching for the heavens, and the other simply dismissing it. Just a case of gamers on two sides taking things to the extremes.
I haven't sifted through any gaf threads on this topic and didn't see it posted within here, but was this ICE programmers follow up tweet posted?
Paul G: So what does this mean in layman terms to us unwashed Philistines? Big jump in PS4 graphics tech?
Cort (ICE TEAM): Most likely results would be faster offline asset baking and GPU capture tools for devs. Unlikely to have much runtime impact.
Paul G: So what does this mean in layman terms to us unwashed Philistines? Big jump in PS4 graphics tech?
Cort (ICE TEAM): Most likely results would be faster offline asset baking and GPU capture tools for devs. Unlikely to have much runtime impact.
Sounds more like behind the scenes optimization, and not so much for real time processing. No big deal, improvements are improvements
A lot of ICE team's improvements have to do with making the dev kits better and easier for developers to use, not necessarily flipping the secret sauce switches. Nothing to go crazy over.
Sounds more like behind the scenes optimization, and not so much for real time processing. No big deal, improvements are improvements
Yep, in the end it will help aide ND and maybe other Sony devs in regards to actual development benefits. I just think it's weird that this insider would attempt to push this as a scoop even in the face of the programmer clearly stating this within same post (three months ago).
1. You're one note.
Your claim that the Xbox One was not designed in great part for TV and Kinect is laughable. Now that MS has cut off one of the Xbox Ones feet, it's left with a stump to hobble around with. No one can deny that there is dedicated hardware that in many cases will now see no use at all. If your claim is that what is left is still good enough, that would depend on your definition of good enough. The fact is, the Xbox One is going to now be used predominantly in a way that its designers had not planned for. Can it still manage to salvage what's left and turn things around? Sure, but don't deny that from an engineering point of view, the Xbox One is far from the ideal product launch.
Awww, somebody went and spoke honestly about your favorite toy and now your feelings got hurt?Might want to be careful about what you wish for. If Mods start doing that your time here may very well would be cut short
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Awww, somebody went and spoke honestly about your favorite toy and now your feelings got hurt?
You wish. Neither of these new consoles have compelled me to rush out and buy one. Favourite toy, lol. your usual fanboy retort holds no merit here
Relax, I'm just poking fun. Why is everyone so damn sensitive? And I'm far from a fanboy, though I can see why you would go there. I have been very critical of the Xbox One, but that is coming from a place of sincere dissatisfaction in what was once my goto platform. If you really paid attention, you would see I'm critical of many things across all platforms, but on this site sadly, anything negative towards MS is fixated upon. Oh well, don't mistake my opining for the fact that I care what you think of me.You wish. Neither of these new consoles have compelled me to rush out and buy one. Favourite toy, lol. your usual fanboy retort holds no merit here
But seriously, we all know you lick Microsoft's boots for fun.
Again, you've misrepresented the claim and the facts. I never claimed Xbox One wasn't designed with Kinect and TV integration in mind. That's just false conjecture on your part (again).
Not at all. Without Kinect, the system can still play the exact same games, and with the interface core, early adopter gamers care about most - the best controller in the world. While Kinect adds a layer of interaction I now can't live without, and it streamlines scenarios I now (thankfully) get to take for granted, the gaming experience on the console isn't sacrificed.
Give me one example, please.
Agreed. My definition of "good enough" is a console with Kinect to sign me in, respond to my vice, recognize which side of the room I'm on, turn on my stereo, TV, and cable box, etc... if it doesn't have that, it's not "good enough" for me. My PS4 wasn't good enough because it lacked all those things. But PS4 is selling wonderfully well, and my needs/wants aren't the same as every other gamer's. Therefore, for some - Xbox One without Kinect is not only "good enough", it's better than one with Kinect because they save $100 in the process for something they didn't want from the beginning.
Oh, that's "the fact" of the matter, eh? Please provide your proof to back up such an assertion. I don't see how anyone could predict that the X1 user base will "predominantly" use the system in a way the designers hadn't planned. Interaction with the system using only a gamepad was indeed planned... but even if it wasn't, I see no evidence that suggest the majority of Xbox One users won't (in time) use Kinect in some capacity. Time will tell, but that's not a "fact" at all, unless you've a Delorean with a flux capacitor you're hiding from the rest of the world, and you've seen the future.
Depends on your definition of "ideal product", doesn't it?
My ideal console is one which includes Kinect, identifies me, has 'snappable' apps, communicates with my other devices, manages my living room for me, replaces my remotes, offers stunning gaming experiences, marries my entertainment needs into one place, and gets me in and out of both gaming and TV entertainment instantly. For me, the X1 is absolutely ideal. It's still new, and it's a young platform - but I vastly prefer it to PS4, and I'm not just saying that because I'm biased. I owned a Windows Mobile phone prior to Windows Phone 7, and it stank. It was a steaming pile. It crashed 10% of the time just answering the phone, and sure it could do true multi-tasking, but I had to manually kill those multiple tasks just to get ONE process to run DECENTLY. It was abysmal, and tragic. It was in no way a competitor to iPhone. I said that then, and I'd say it again today. Not all MS products are ideal, not all of our strategies perfect, and (obviously) not all of our messaging is solid... but I love the X1 as it launched. For me, it was truly ideal... but for others who don't want to spend money on a device like Kinect, I get it. Their voices have been heard. Why would we not accommodate those fans? If they want a box without a Kinect, that's great - let's get them one. Without Kinect, and without the IR blasting - it's still an amazing gaming device. Ryse is still the best looking game out there, and it doesn't require Kinect to run. Titanfall is the best MP experience out there, and it doesn't require Kinect to run. Forza is the best next-gen racer, and it runs at 1080p/60fps without a Kinect. Dead Rising is the goofiest, silliest, and totally-guilty-pleasure-fun zombie game on next gen consoles, and it's fine without Kinect...
X1 is completely fine as a game console without Kinect. I wouldn't want one without Kinect, because to go back to a world without (for me) is like going back to a non-internet enabled cell phone (it's a step back technologically), but you know, our primary competitor who's selling a boat load doesn't have it, and consumers love it... so let's give those folks who aren't as picky as me an option. The console isn't crippled at all by taking Kinect out... it's just removing a feature that some don't care about or want.
Hahahaha... wow.
Well, that certainly deflates this whole thread... and it re-enforces my position that until more facts are known, there's no justification to make any sweeping perf-increase claims.
Love it.
But hey, a benefit for faster development means that devs can spend more time in areas that *do* impact runtime more substantially, so it's a good thing for sure, just not something comparable (at all) to the DX12 advances Microsoft is bringing to the table.
Is anyone in this thread even trumpeting the enhancements to the PS4? Seems like everyone was acknowledging that it was likely no big deal in between the schill droning of your posts.
That ICE team tweet made months ago may have nothing to do with what Tidux was referring to in the OP. Of course Flynn would automatically assume that so he can dismiss it, while acting as obnoxious as possible laughing and saying "love it". (hint: doing that drives people away from your favorite brand)
He just has to derail every thread with versus nonsense and spinning that won't result in a single extra Xbox sale. Not that anyone expected beyond3d level tech discussion here, but might as well shut the thread down at this point.
He just has to derail every thread with versus nonsense and spinning that won't result in a single extra Xbox sale. Not that anyone expected beyond3d level tech discussion here, but might as well shut the thread down at this point.
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I think people have been pretty reasonable about their expectations in this thread, actually, but the point is - the thread's core topic morphed to "DX12 vs. PS4's perf boost", and this isn't really a perf boost at all for the PS4... plus, it's only a rumor in the first place... so, it's a rumor, which even if true, results in little to no gain in runtime... meaning, it'll have no meaningful "power boost" of any kind.
That further ICE tweet makes any comparison to DX12 completely meaningless and baseless... as one directly impacts runtime perf efficiency, and the other doesn't. So (again), it's not really a "power boost" at all... which is what this whole thread implies (or flat out states).
In that sense, clearly this thread is now deflated. I'm still happy to respond to your quibbles (fallacious as they maybe), but yeah - there's nothing really more to say here. Well done, ICE team, for making developing games better/faster for yourselves... that may inadvertently benefit the product in some non-direct way, but it's clearly not really a "power boost" at all, which is the premise this thread was created with.
The performance of the console will be enhanced by software upgrades. Now where have we heard that before? Anyway, sounds reasonable to me.
True (hence, why I mentioned it "morphed" into that), but even upon creation of the original thread - the intent of the thread was to highlight a rumor, which most understood to be a rumor indicating the PS4 would get some major (or minor) performance boost (something similar to DX12 which the X1 will enjoy). That understanding is now no longer accurate or relevant. There's no power boost here. There's an efficiency gain for the team making the product, which may or may not manifest itself in some capacity down the line in the end product... but even if it does, it will be through indirect means (meaning they may save some time, and therefore get more time to focus on the things which do result in real-world perf gains at runtime), not direct means (ala DX12).
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