Official Ryse Discussion Thread
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If it's standard that means all games have 1080p60fps. Needless to say you can't find ppl who said it would be standard. Saying it would be standard isn't the same as wishing it were standard.
Sure. I can understand ppl clinging to artificial and meaningless cat calls for 'standards' when graphics continue moving towards highly diminished returns as they have been. It's natural to want graphics fidelity to progress indefinitely, so as things plateau as they have been we want our lust for progress to be satiated in the only other manner available, technical measures on the games, even ones that have become largely meaningless in describing visuals.
But the baseline logic is shallow as hell on both the framerate issue and the resolution issue. Games today, even next gen games, simply don't have the texture detail on screen to depict enough fidelity in the assets for 1080p to be necessary in the march towards realism. 720p movies are much more realistic than any game running at any resolution. The visual immersion there isn't problematic simply because of the pixel counts. In other words, the bottleneck to achieving "photorealism" is NOT in pixel counts. It's in movement and how movement is portrayed in the game world and shaders and lighting and cleaning up visual artifacts. IQ is not about resolution by itself in a bubble. 720p movies pretty much always look 'cleaner' than 1080p native games do. We've gotta ways to go before resolution is a real bottleneck imho.
I think there comes a point when it really is beyond something any reasonable human being could argue when ppl ONLY EVER whined about RYSE's resolution once it was told to us. Same goes for the poly count nonsense. NOBODY noticed that at all. What we DO notice, however, is how incredible the game looks anyhow.
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stand·ard
/ˈstændərd/ model.
2.
an object that is regarded as the usual or most common size or form of its kind: We stock the deluxe models as well as the standards.
3.
a rule or principle that is used as a basis for judgment: They tried to establish standards for a new philosophical approach.
4.
an average or normal requirement, quality, quantity, level, grade, etc.: His work this week hasn't been up to his usual standard.
5.
standards, those morals, ethics, habits, etc., established by authority, custom, or an individual as acceptable: He tried to live up to his father's standards
"requirement"...
If you are talking about a platform having a standard established as a technical requirement set by the manufacturer, that is implying all games on that platform must abide by that standard (if it is actually maintained).
For the record, I've always been 100% in the camp that such standards are stupid and shouldn't exist at the technical design level. So I'm glad MS/Sony aren't doing that. I'm all for more management options for devs (like MS is doing with display planes), but that shouldn't dictate your design targets a priori.
If you are talking about a platform having a standard established as a technical requirement set by the manufacturer, that is implying all games on that platform must abide by that standard (if it is actually maintained).
For the record, I've always been 100% in the camp that such standards are stupid and shouldn't exist at the technical design level. So I'm glad MS/Sony aren't doing that. I'm all for more management options for devs (like MS is doing with display planes), but that shouldn't dictate your design targets a priori.
Average or normal requirement.
Anyone? I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed. But standard doesn't mean all. Does it?
I'm not trying to be snarky Astro. I like you as a poster. I just think your definition of standard is wrong.
Anyone? I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed. But standard doesn't mean all. Does it?
I'm not trying to be snarky Astro. I like you as a poster. I just think your definition of standard is wrong.
There can be different interpretations of the word standard. I work as a web developer, and I know that when something is a standard for our web apps, it means that is how it's done everywhere, no questions asked.
So I think you're both right in your definition. As for which interpretation is right for the Xbox One, I don't know that.
It is listing requirement as an entry in a set of options there alongside "quality, quantity, level, grade, etc." Tech standards on platforms are technical requirements established by the platform holder in the context of what we are discussing. Hence, that is the item amongst that set which is useful for the definition (in this context).
OK I was wrong apologies Astro.
I guess what Ketto was saying is that most thought, or still do think, that 1080P will be the most commonly used resolution in the coming generation.
I guess what Ketto was saying is that most thought, or still do think, that 1080P will be the most commonly used resolution in the coming generation.
Ha. No apology necessary. And 1080p will be the most common one used next gen (for better or worse depending on your perspective). Remember, launch software doesn't reflect technical trends for the entire coming cycle. Far from it. I just hope devs don't cave to pressure from 'gamers' who demand arbitrary tech features as if they single handedly make the game look better. Designing games is about trade offs and optimizations. We shouldn't forget that. We should applaud clever trade offs that net notable gains in light of what they give up...not attack those companies making those grand bargains successfully.
If losing some polygons and pixels to the point literally nobody even noticed, then any payoff is welcomed as that trade...especially notably better GI, objects/enemies on screen, LOD management, and normal map res. This is 100% win for Crytek and RYSE. Give up nothing aesthetically to the viewer while gaining a slew of very significant (and aesthetically obvious) upgrades.
If someone says "I think all games should be 1080p60 as standard" that is not the same as that person confirming that they are indeed they're all 1080p60, again how you arrived at such I honestly don't know. It really can't get anymore simple than that at all, I need a drink.
That was my point originally. Less drinking (or smoking as the case may be with you)...more reading. Arguing something should be a certain way, or outright demanding it as some lunatics did on various forums for whatever reason, is very different than arguing that it will be that way. Lemme remind you what you originally said:
"Winner, the only people who thought that all next gen titles were going to be 1080p60 were...fanboys, despite being told for like a year plus that 1080p60 wasn't going to be a standard."
I said nobody was saying that as far I was aware, to which you replied to sarcastically with "Yea okay." Again, my point was that there's a difference between ppl arguing that "all next gen titles [are] going to be 1080p60" and arguing that they should be. The only I recall really even demanding such a standard was the PC elitist fanboy side, which you are a proud member of I might add.
Oh is that what I'm doing? I'm talking abut the game, aren't I?
Yes it will suck.
That lighting is amazing! The faces and armor look superb.
Man astro reminding me I'm a fanboy, that's meta. That's like a 9th grade drop out making fun of someone for dropping out of 10th grade! O.O
Indeed.
Indeed.
I'll get it if the story is good (at least rent it). I love the setting. I'm just really worried by the gameplay.
I just see no reason why we shouldn't be getting 1080p with amazing graphics. I mean you can say whatever you want but fact is we've been in this generation for more than twice as long and and we were getting 720p this gen already. Why shouldn't we move up from that? why shouldn't we get hardware that can actually give us that? after waiting so long? it makes no sense to me. These companies have had a decade to come out with new hardware and software to wow us.
What does that have to do with anything? 360 came out with s*** that wasn't even on pc at the time. We've spent a decade at 720p and below. We should have hardware capable of great things @ 1080p.
Go build a PC, simple as that. They compromise on the resolution to add more graphical effects with the mediocre hardware that are inside these cheap boxes.
I'd rather play a game with full graphical effects at a lower resolution than the inverse. But that's just me.
Because it's not necessary. Numbers like that don't actually impress anyone. Visuals do. And tossing out visual fidelity for the sake of hitting some totally meaningless, and impossible to discern, metric in-game is r******d.
They have. RYSE continues to wow ppl, 900p and all. So did The Order, Deep Down, BF4, etc. All sub-1080p last we heard. It's not that the hardware isn't able to do 1080p. Lots of X1 games are 1080p native. It's that devs know how to do their job better than you know how to do their job. They are making the right decisions obviously, as not a soul so much as suspected RYSE was anything but 1080p until we were told. I am thrilled that MS designed things like display planes to help devs get sharp images where they actually matter without wasting needless GPU cycles. We've hit the wall where diminishing returns in pixel counts bottlenecks the visuals already. No reason to just keep pushing against it when innovative and clever alternatives exist to help devs get around it.
We do have hardware that is capable of great things at 1080p. That doesn't mean every game will be 1080p though. That goes for both consoles this gen.
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