Numbers Discussion Thread

[Qbert]

If MS can't sell more units in 50 additional countries to make up most of the difference, then the people on these forums that say they can't, better go work for Microsoft so they can save the company billions of dollars trying to sell, produce and market the Xbox for those countries. Clearly Microsoft has no idea what they are doing.

Stop being such a drama queen. Of course it'll sell....what people are saying, is that it will not sell enough to beat out PS4 in total world wide. The extra amount sold won't amount to much. Go back and look at past history, and see how many 360s were sold in some of these countries.
Those countries combined won't give MS close to 2 million in sales.

 

[Dno69]

Sold to retailer = Exact numbers.

Sold to consumer = Estimate

Why such a fuss is being made is unclear. NPD only covers around 70% of the US businesses, so that is either 30% estimated or not included at all. So, why is this better ?

So Sony's numbers could be lower or in fact even higher? And the 5 million shipped for Microsoft is an exact number, but we don't know how much made it to consumers homes?

If so, it's kind of funny that your point wasn't addressed at all.

 

[menace-uk-]

So Sony's numbers could be lower or in fact even higher? And the 5 million shipped for Microsoft is an exact number, but we don't know how much made it to consumers homes?

If so, it's kind of funny that your point wasn't addressed at all.

Yep, could be higher or lower for both as far as NPD goes. WW numbers are exact from MS. Sony, again will be estimates, so could be lower or higher. Although perhaps not significantly so given how hard a PS4 was to find in the first 3-4 months.

 

[Plainview]

But Europe also include France, Germany & UK? Anyway, I think rest of the region X1 launch will add maybe 10-15% of Sales. It will have impact. Launching in these area will not make MS exceed Sony, but stay a bit closer. Most people expect these places to sell more PS4, which is base on the information that PS4 outsold X1 in just about every region except maybe Brazil where PS4 cost significantly more. I am just pointing out what happen in reality.

I would presume PS4 is readily available in NA already, but PS4 is still selling out very fast where I lived.

MS have a lot of work to do if MS wanted to have a comparable Market share with Sony.

Anyway, I want to point out to Idlehand that many of the countries launched by Sony are NOT third world. Just to get it out of my mind.

UK, no.

 

[JinCA]

While it's true the PS4 is available in more areas people have to remember that most of the supply is being shipped to areas where both companies are directly competing, not only that but the X1 is already out in the strongest markets they had last time around and it's currently losing in those areas even with the PS4 having supply issues. When the X1 does finally release in the markets that only the PS4 is currently available in it's not likely to sell all that well, those are areas that the 360 wasn't all that successful in last gen.

 

[Hammerclaw]

While it's true the PS4 is available in more areas people have to remember that most of the supply is being shipped to areas where both companies are directly competing, not only that but the X1 is already out in the strongest markets they had last time around and it's currently losing in those areas even with the PS4 having supply issues. When the X1 does finally release in the markets that only the PS4 is currently available in it's not likely to sell all that well, those are areas that the 360 wasn't all that successful in last gen.

What also has to be understood is half or more of 360 sales were outside the United States, 8 million in the UK alone, so, in total, the foreign market is very important. Even 2 million sales in Japan. Those nichols and dimes add up.

 

[JinCA]

What also has to be understood is half or more of 360 sales were outside the United States, 8 million in the UK alone, so, in total, the foreign market is very important. Even 2 million sales in Japan. Those nichols and dimes add up.

Japan was just over 1.6 million for the 360 but that's just nitpicking The X1 is available in the biggest parts of Europe already, all countries matter but the ones that were delayed are smaller and also were won by Sony last gen. As far as I know the only part of Europe the 360 won in was the UK (yes it's also the biggest) but currently places like Spain, France and Germany are selling far more PS4's than X1's and the PS4 is also doing better than the X1 in the UK.

 

[Hammerclaw]

Japan was just over 1.6 million for the 360 but that's just nitpicking The X1 is available in the biggest parts of Europe already, all countries matter but the ones that were delayed are smaller and also were won by Sony last gen. As far as I know the only part of Europe the 360 won in was the UK (yes it's also the biggest) but currently places like Spain, France and Germany are selling far more PS4's than X1's.

Good. The sooner those markets are saturated, the better. It will give all the gamers something to trade in on an Xbox One, on down the road.

 

[starseeker]

When the X1 does finally release in the markets that only the PS4 is currently available in it's not likely to sell all that well, those are areas that the 360 wasn't all that successful in last gen.

X1 will likely not sell as well, no one one except MS is responsible for that.

However its a NOT TRUE, that 360 is unsuccessful outside of few market like NA & UK. This is a wrong statement I find a lot of our NA friends like to make. Sales of PS3 & Xbox360 are fairly close in many major region. I think we have about 360: PS3 45:55 here in Mittlehessen, I am guessing similar figures in other part of Western Europe, South America, Asia (exclude Japan), & maybe some places where X1 actually sell better.

 

[JinCA]

X1 will likely not sell as well, no one one except MS is responsible for that.

However its a NOT TRUE, that 360 is unsuccessful outside of few market like NA & UK. This is a wrong statement I find a lot of our NA friends like to make. Sales of PS3 & Xbox360 are fairly close in many major region. I think we have about 360: PS3 45:55 here in Mittlehessen, I am guessing similar figures in other part of Western Europe, South America, Asia (exclude Japan), & maybe some places where X1 actually sell better.

There is no way the PS3 tied the 360 globally while massively losing in NA (by about 15 million) and losing the UK without doing substantially better than the 360 in just about every other market. Japan only made up about 7-8 million of that difference. 10% can be fairly substantial btw.

 

[Andy]

Didn't I read something about MS preparing to launch in a bunch of countries this fall? How many, anyone know?

I guess we'll be able to gauge the impact better then.

 

[starseeker]

There is no way the PS3 tied the 360 globally while massively losing in NA (by about 15 million) and losing the UK without doing substantially better than the 360 in just about every other market. Japan only made up about 7-8 million of that difference. 10% is fairly substantial btw.

Its not. When I am time, I can look up data, but its not substantially better. All the places I have been, I have not seen any clear difference. maybe 10-25% difference.

Now X1 vs PS4, thats massive. We are talking about double or even more.

 

[starseeker]

Didn't I read something about MS preparing to launch in a bunch of countries this fall? How many, anyone know?

I guess we'll be able to gauge the impact better then.

26, It was listed somewhere this thread.

 

[JinCA]

Its not. When I am time, I can look up data, but its not substantially better. All the places I have been, I have not seen any clear difference. maybe 10-25% difference.

Now X1 vs PS4, thats massive. We are talking about double or even more.

BTW the post you replied to, I never said the 360 wasn't a success I said that the PS3 won those areas which they did. When it comes to the PS4 yes it's outselling the X1 by a wide margin in just about every European market right now (to a slightly lesser degree in the UK but they lost there last time) but the ones where MS is set to release later this year are not places that they won last time and I doubt that'll change this time around either. We'll just have to agree to disagree on 10% being significant or not.

 

[IdleHands]

Those nichols and dimes add up.

Maybe not. How much did they spend shipping the product there, marketing and so forth?

Also, nickels*

 

[starseeker]

BTW the post you replied to, I never said the 360 wasn't a success I said that the PS3 won those areas which they did. When it comes to the PS4 yes it's outselling the X1 by a wide margin in just about every European market right now (to a slightly lesser degree in the UK but they lost there last time) but the ones where MS is set to release later this year are not places that they won last time and I doubt that'll change this time around either. We'll just have to agree to disagree on 10% being significant or not.

OK, Fair enough.

My point being, popularity of XBOX 360 is very similar to PS3 in other place, & MS have every chance to overtake Sony in these places current gen. I keep hearing, XBOX is not popular in Continental Europe & Asia, so we are not expecting Next gen Xbox to sell well there. This is so untrue. MS have every chance to be as successful, or even more successful in everywhere, except Japan.

But this did not happen of course, but like I said, no one but MS is responsible for the poor sales (with respect to PS4) outside of NA.

 

[TDbank24]

So the Xbox One has sold 5 million consoles to retailers and we're complaining about what exactly again? I have that Metallica song stuck in my head.. And nothing else matters.

http://www.polygon.com/2014/4/17/5626130/xbox-one-sales-5-million

 

[Hammerclaw]

Maybe not. How much did they spend shipping the product there, marketing and so forth?

Also, nickels*

I don't know. How much did Sony spend on shipping and so forth? (Spell check wasn't working.)

 

[Qbert]

What also has to be understood is half or more of 360 sales were outside the United States, 8 million in the UK alone, so, in total, the foreign market is very important. Even 2 million sales in Japan. Those nichols and dimes add up.

But those nickels and dimes added up over the course of 8 years....in the grand scheme of things, those nickels and dimes simply aren't enough to turn the tide in XB1s favor over the PS4. Yes...obviously, it'll mean more XB1s sold, but this early, just not enough to put it near on par with PS4 sales.

 

[Dno69]

But those nickels and dimes added up over the course of 8 years....in the grand scheme of things, those nickels and dimes simply aren't enough to turn the tide in XB1s favor over the PS4. Yes...obviously, it'll mean more XB1s sold, but this early, just not enough to put it near on par with PS4 sales.

Is there anyone saying that if the Xbox One was sold in all the markets that PS4 is currently sold in, that the sales would be better or even on par with the PS4's WW numbers? I just see people saying that it would narrow the gap a bit.

 

[Qbert]

Is there anyone saying that if the Xbox One was sold in all the markets that PS4 is currently sold in, that the sales would be better or even on par with the PS4's WW numbers? I just see people saying that it would narrow the gap a bit.

come on now....you know very well that the insinuation is there that PS4 is doing better "because" it released in more markets. What we're saying is, even if XB1 released in these markets, chances are, the extra sales would be minimal, certainly not enough to close the gap by much.....meaning, the difference would still be pretty large.

 

[Dno69]

come on now....you know very well that the insinuation is there that PS4 is doing better "because" it released in more markets. What we're saying is, even if XB1 released in these markets, chances are, the extra sales would be minimal, certainly not enough to close the gap by much.....meaning, the difference would still be pretty large.

So in other words, no one is saying that.

 

[Dno69]

And many of us think it will. There is no use in arguing over opinions as there is no right answer.

Btw no need to insult people by calling then drama queens. A bit old for that.

So you do think that the 2 million unit gap will be erased with more markets?

 

[Kvally]

So you do think that the 2 million unit gap will be erased with more markets?

I think with the addition of the extra markets, competitive pricing, and continued focus on great games, that the Xbox One has the ability to take the lead by the end of the generation.

No idea if it will , and makes no difference to me if it does or doesn't. I already own both, so I am set

 

[Dno69]

I think with the addition of the extra markets, competitive pricing, and continued focus on great games, that the Xbox One has the ability to take the lead by the end of the generation.

No idea if it will , and makes no difference to me if it does or doesn't. I already own both, so I am set

Ok. Thanks for the clarification.

I have both (all three actually) so I don't care who sells more either. It wont affect my enjoyment one way or the other. But I do think Sony has the mindshare so far and that Microsoft has an up hill battle.

Price drops and great games will help the situation. I just hope for a healthy market for everyone involved.

 

[starseeker]

I think with the addition of the extra markets, competitive pricing, and continued focus on great games, that the Xbox One has the ability to take the lead by the end of the generation.

No idea if it will , and makes no difference to me if it does or doesn't. I already own both, so I am set

Yes, if MS price competitively, (something that just about everyone have been telling MS when they announced the price), improve the efficient so games in future will be on par with PS4, free Taylor Swift concert ticket with every Xbox .etc. Why not.

But of course Sony can also price their console lower, & 2 tickets to Taylor Swift concert tickets with every PS4. Who knows.

However if MS launch with similar price point as other region, & Kinect still lack content, & TV/Media still work in the few major markets, you will expect similar results as what we have now.

Its a marathon, who know who will end up victor, but for sure, MS have a lot more work to do than Sony this gen to be the victor, thats for sure.

 

[Kvally]

Yes, if MS price competitively, (something that just about everyone have been telling MS when they announced the price), improve the efficient so games in future will be on par with PS4, free Taylor Swift concert ticket with every Xbox .etc. Why not.

But of course Sony can also price their console lower, & 2 tickets to Taylor Swift concert tickets with every PS4. Who knows.

However if MS launch with similar price point as other region, & Kinect still lack content, & TV/Media still work in the few major markets, you will expect similar results as what we have now.

Its a marathon, who know who will end up victor, but for sure, MS have a lot more work to do than Sony this gen to be the victor, thats for sure.

Yup it's a lot of work for them, but they can do it. Sony still sold more consoles than MS last gen when you look at the year release difference. But the Xbox was still successful even though it didn't sell as fast as the PS3. We got great games and a huge community to play with others on.

To me, success is the great games and support.

 

[Kvally]

Yes, if MS price competitively, (something that just about everyone have been telling MS when they announced the price), improve the efficient so games in future will be on par with PS4, free Taylor Swift concert ticket with every Xbox .etc. Why not.

But of course Sony can also price their console lower, & 2 tickets to Taylor Swift concert tickets with every PS4. Who knows.

However if MS launch with similar price point as other region, & Kinect still lack content, & TV/Media still work in the few major markets, you will expect similar results as what we have now.

Its a marathon, who know who will end up victor, but for sure, MS have a lot more work to do than Sony this gen to be the victor, thats for sure.

Yup it's a lot of work for them, but they can do it. Sony still sold more consoles than MS last gen when you look at the year release difference. But the Xbox was still successful even though it didn't sell as fast as the PS3. We got great games and a huge community to play with others on.

To me, success is the great games and support.

 

[Hammerclaw]

But those nickels and dimes added up over the course of 8 years....in the grand scheme of things, those nickels and dimes simply aren't enough to turn the tide in XB1s favor over the PS4. Yes...obviously, it'll mean more XB1s sold, but this early, just not enough to put it near on par with PS4 sales.

Why does everyone assume Microsoft is going to use Sony's playbook, verbatim? Sorry Q, I can't see future, but I'm confident it will be better than you're curt dismissal suggests.

 

[Jackie_Fhan]

I'm going to have to believe it would have benefited sony to ship another million to US last year for holiday and not in those other countries. Would have sold most of them, and sold less xbox's I beleive.