The Xbox Onesie

The theory being passed around as to why Sony is getting all the marketing deals is that Microsoft is putting that money into first party games and whatever else. We'll see at E3. Going by the rumored lineup they've done a decent job getting some games. Just have to wait and see.

At this point, Scorpio advertises itself. It would be nice to see games like Star Wars Battlefront 2 on stage running at 4k/60fps but all in due time. Hardcore gamers will buy Scorpio regardless of what is shown. Another reason why Microsoft could be passing on marketing rights is to sell Scorpio at $399. That would be great.
 
VaLLiancE said:
It was important but you forget this every time you forget to add the PS4's HUGE Ram advantage vs the XBO with the dumb just comparing GPU's(over 40% PS4 advantage) and over exaggerating CPU vs CPU advantages(when no comparisons updated the extra core Sony unlocked years after nullifying much of the already minor XBO advantage)

But hey we have front page stories that falsely show Scorpio at 50% better than Pro and forgetting to list 9GB's of total Pro ram.
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XB1's RAM was slower, but it had the same amount as PS4.

We've established Scorpio's RAM is faster than Pro's and has a massive cache advantage. It's not the same amount of RAM like PS4/XB1 and can't be spun. Its different than the X1/ps4 difference.
 
de3d1 said:
XB1's RAM was slower, but it had the same amount as PS4.

We've established Scorpio's RAM is faster than Pro's and has a massive cache advantage. It's not the same amount of RAM like PS4/XB1 and can't be spun. Its different than the X1/ps4 difference.
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Well if you need to get technical then yeah only 40%+ change... :txbrolleyes:
 
If you want to get reasonable, the GPU differential (Flops) should mean a 900p to 1080p type leap for most games...except we don't know how many of those 900p Xbox one games were purely by the SRAM insufficient size

So worst case we should see checkerboard vs True 4k leaps....and yet this is double the resolution...so clearly its not the full story.

CPU will be same difference as Xbox One and PS4, a fee frames here and there.

Memory quantity, should be like GameCube vs Dreamcast. Obvious for the right games.

If you want to take something tangible away, if the Forza Tech is an example of a typical Xbox One game running at Native 4k with 5GB worth of 4k assets and only using 65% power...well that means once native 4k is reached with native 4k assets they will have a 3rd more power and 3gb of ram to play with.
 
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de3d1 said:
XB1's RAM was slower, but it had the same amount as PS4.

We've established Scorpio's RAM is faster than Pro's and has a massive cache advantage. It's not the same amount of RAM like PS4/XB1 and can't be spun. Its different than the X1/ps4 difference.
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XBO's ram was WAYYYY slower.
Pro and Scorpio use the same ram type although one is slightly faster and higher.
8 GB DDR3 is worse than 4 GB GDDR5 in most scenarios.
So yeah it can't be spun the differences are much smaller with Pro and Scorpio's Ram.
 
Sasquatch Montana said:
If you want to get reasonable, the GPU differential (Flops) should mean a 900p to 1080p type leap for most games...except we don't know how many of those 900p Xbox one games were purely by the SRAM did.

So worst case we should see checkerboard vs True 4k leaps....and yet this is double the resolution...so clearly its not the full story.

CPU will be same difference as Xbox One and PS4, a fee frames here and there.

Memory quantity, should be like GameCube vs Dreamcast. Obvious for the right games.

If you want to take something tangible away, if the Forza Tech is an example of a typical Xbox One game running at Native 4k with 5GB worth of 4k assets and only using 65% power...well that means once native 4k is reached with native 4k assets they will have a 3rd more power and 3gb of ram to play with.
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I agree with this
 
VaLLiancE said:
XBO's ram was WAYYYY slower.
Pro and Scorpio use the same ram type although one is slightly faster and higher.
8 GB DDR3 is worse than 4 GB GDDR5 in most scenarios.
So yeah it can't be spun the differences are much smaller with Pro and Scorpio's Ram.
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Do you have a link that GDDR5 is 100% more efficient in consoles? Never heard that before for consoles.
 
de3d1 said:
Do you have a link that GDDR5 is 100% more efficient in consoles? Never heard that before for consoles.
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It was talked about when 4GB GDDR5 was the rumored PS4(well it was but Sony upped it)
amount of ram.
In most cases the significantly faster ram beats out the slower/higher amount ram.
 
VaLLiancE said:
XBO's ram was WAYYYY slower.
Pro and Scorpio use the same ram type although one is slightly faster and higher.
8 GB DDR3 is worse than 4 GB GDDR5 in most scenarios.
So yeah it can't be spun the differences are much smaller with Pro and Scorpio's Ram.
Click to expand...

I thought Scorpio had a 50% increase in bandwidth, as well as, a 50% increase in overall amount of ram. That seems pretty significant to me.
 
VaLLiancE said:
It was talked about when 4GB GDDR5 was the rumored PS4(well it was but Sony upped it)
amount of ram.
In most cases the significantly faster ram beats out the slower/higher amount ram.
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The problem with this spin you are using is it has been went over, and the ps4 wins in RAM with GDDR5, we all know that, but the ESRAM makes up some of that difference.

“That depends on who you talk to. In my personal opinion the eSRAM does not quite make up for it but it makes it really close,” Stardock CEO Brad Wardell said to GamingBolt in a recent interview. However he believes that the PS4 is a better hardware given that the console has more compute units compared to the Xbox One. “The real problem is that the Xbox One only has 12 what you would call cores on their GPU and I think the PlayStation 4 has around 18. The hardware on the PlayStation 4 in my opinion is better than the hardware on the Xbox One.”
Read more at http://gamingbolt.com/xbox-ones-esr...-gpu-cores-still-a-factor#0b7pe2ZqcjqOrUbj.99
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Case closed, 3GB more RAM(that's faster) is not "really close."

You'll never hear a developer say the RAM setup in Scorpio and Pro are really close in terms of what can be used. I can find more examples of developers saying the same sort of thing as above if needed.
 
There will be games soon. Either you'll notice the difference or you won't. It's seems like a waste to do a tech comparison now. I'd say the memory diff is a big deal but we'll have evidence shortly.
 
I'm legit BBQ this Sunday for the event. Then I'm buying like snack foods and s*** after E3 and swoop over to gaf afterward. That sh!ts gonna be ridiculous and I want front row seats. lol.
 
de3d1 said:
The problem with this spin you are using is it has been went over, and the ps4 wins in RAM with GDDR5, we all know that, but the ESRAM makes up some of that difference.




Case closed, 3GB more RAM(that's faster) is not "really close."

You'll never hear a developer say the RAM setup in Scorpio and Pro are really close in terms of what can be used. I can find more examples of developers saying the same sort of thing as above if needed.
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lakers_oh_snap.gif
 
VaLLiancE said:
Its 40+% better in GPU the ram isn't much faster.
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You're very wrong as usual.

Ps4 Pro has 218GB/s memory bandwidth.

Scorpio has 326GB/s memory bandwidth.

That isnt a "little" faster that's a LOT faster.
 
VaLLiancE said:
Its 40+% better in GPU the ram isn't much faster.
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Erm, there is more to bandwidth then just sheer percentages. It is important that you can keep the framebuffer filled, and in that regard Scorpio is more than enough. There literally is 50% more bandwidth available to the GPU, as in 128 extra bits per cycle. If you want to see what that does on a game, try comparing a 256 bit memory controlled graphics card to a 384 bits one. It usually is able to run at a higher resolution, with better shadow, lighting and other effects at the same frame rate.

PS4 Pro, really is a half arsed approach to the 4K problem, and is really not designed to handle PS4 games on a 4K resolution with 4K assets. Something Scorpio IS designed to do (handle Xbox One games at 4K with 4K assets). It even has room to spare.
 
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eVo7 said:
You're very wrong as usual.

Ps4 Pro has 218GB/s memory bandwidth.

Scorpio has 326GB/s memory bandwidth.

That isnt a "little" faster that's a LOT faster.
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Yeah, but you're neglecting the Cernymath where PS4 can use 16 bit floats and so really it's 536 GB/sec because even though that might be the stupidest argument since the Buffalo BilLLLLs debating where to hold their Super Bowl victory parade, I'm sure that someone somewhere even now is about to drop that bomb.
 
hrudey said:
Yeah, but you're neglecting the Cernymath where PS4 can use 16 bit floats and so really it's 536 GB/sec because even though that might be the stupidest argument since the Buffalo BilLLLLs debating where to hold their Super Bowl victory parade, I'm sure that someone somewhere even now is about to drop that bomb.
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The killer from Silence of the Lambs got a parade?

I'm loving it!!!
 
Dehnus said:
Erm, there is more to bandwidth then just sheer percentages. It is important that you can keep the framebuffer filled, and in that regard Scorpio is more than enough. There literally is 50% more bandwidth available to the GPU, as in 128 extra bits per cycle. If you want to see what that does on a game, try comparing a 256 bit memory controlled graphics card to a 384 bits one. It usually is able to run at a higher resolution, with better shadow, lighting and other effects at the same frame rate.

PS4 Pro, really is a half arsed approach to the 4K problem, and is really not designed to handle PS4 games on a 4K resolution with 4K assets. Something Scorpio IS designed to do (handle Xbox One games at 4K with 4K assets). It even has room to spare.
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Every time I hear, "room to spare" I get hyped. That's s***s crazy...
 
Dehnus said:
Erm, there is more to bandwidth then just sheer percentages. It is important that you can keep the framebuffer filled, and in that regard Scorpio is more than enough. There literally is 50% more bandwidth available to the GPU, as in 128 extra bits per cycle. If you want to see what that does on a game, try comparing a 256 bit memory controlled graphics card to a 384 bits one. It usually is able to run at a higher resolution, with better shadow, lighting and other effects at the same frame rate.

PS4 Pro, really is a half arsed approach to the 4K problem, and is really not designed to handle PS4 games on a 4K resolution with 4K assets. Something Scorpio IS designed to do (handle Xbox One games at 4K with 4K assets). It even has room to spare.
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Someone who makes a 40 into a 50 and got specs wrong..I won't listen 2. move along.
 
eVo7 said:
You're very wrong as usual.

Ps4 Pro has 218GB/s memory bandwidth.

Scorpio has 326GB/s memory bandwidth.

That isnt a "little" faster that's a LOT faster.
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When I said little I meant in comparison "speed wise" to PS4 vs XBO ram being a bigger speed difference.
 
de3d1 said:
The problem with this spin you are using is it has been went over, and the ps4 wins in RAM with GDDR5, we all know that, but the ESRAM makes up some of that difference.




Case closed, 3GB more RAM(that's faster) is not "really close."

You'll never hear a developer say the RAM setup in Scorpio and Pro are really close in terms of what can be used. I can find more examples of developers saying the same sort of thing as above if needed.
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Nope as the results have shown(when parity wasn't enforced) PS4 games exhibited 40+% higher resolutions and sometimes 50+% better performance.
If that ram combo worked so well....
We wouldn't EVER see 720p XBO games
We wouldn't EVER see 900p vs 1080p
We wouldn't EVER see 60fps vs 30fps

The speed gap was bigger with XBO and PS4.
Having more of the same type of ram and it running faster is pretty big as well but I expect this along with the GPU advantage of the Scorpio to be better showcased in 1st party offerings where the only parity will be with XBO...
 
VaLLiancE said:
Nope as the results have shown(when parity wasn't enforced) PS4 games exhibited 40+% higher resolutions and sometimes 50+% better performance.
If that ram combo worked so well....
We wouldn't EVER see 720p XBO games
We wouldn't EVER see 900p vs 1080p
We wouldn't EVER see 60fps vs 30fps

The speed gap was bigger with XBO and PS4.
Having more of the same type of ram and it running faster is pretty big as well but I expect this along with the GPU advantage of the Scorpio to be better showcased in 1st party offerings where the only parity will be with XBO...
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The point someone made earlier, is that it was an arduous process to actually exploit the ESRAM, but it was possible to help bridge the gap(and why first party games were more likely to exploit it successfully.)

It's all dependant on the effort going into it. Just the same as some ports have run worse on more recent hardware.

Just typing EVER is silly, when there are so many other factors involved.
 
Bellybama said:
The point someone made earlier, is that it was an arduous process to actually exploit the ESRAM, but it was possible to help bridge the gap(and why first party games were more likely to exploit it successfully.)

It's all dependant on the effort going into it. Just the same as some ports have run worse on more recent hardware.

Just typing EVER is silly, when there are so many other factors involved.
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4 years in and its been non existed.
Not helping much and NEVER will.
 
VaLLiancE said:
4 years in and its been non existed.
Not helping much and NEVER will.
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Do you have any proof that it wasn't used? The differences can be attributed to the gpu gap.

Also, we're getting off topic. My point was the differences in the RAM is more with Scorpio over Ps4 pro. I have links were developers say the Xbox one can close the gap on ps4's RAM advantage. Do you have anything similar concerning Pro's RAM closing the gap? Yes or no?
 
de3d1 said:
Do you have any proof that it wasn't used? The differences can be attributed to the gpu gap.

Also, we're getting off topic. My point was the differences in the RAM is more with Scorpio over Ps4 pro. I have links were developers say the Xbox one can close the gap on ps4's RAM advantage. Do you have anything similar concerning Pro's RAM closing the gap? Yes or no?
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This fun we are having(you aint mad at me right bro) does need 2 be moved.
I have the examples I gave you of how most games significantly are better on PS4 esram couldn't help.
If we don't see the power gap differences its because of parity that ugly P word.
If we don't see differences Pro vs Scorpio its PARITY.
When that P word isn't happening we will 900p vs 1080p type differences with Pro and Scorpio.
Ready for the kicker? The new 720p is 1080p on the Pro.
 
VaLLiancE said:
This fun we are having(you aint mad at me right bro) does need 2 be moved.
I have the examples I gave you of how most games significantly are better on PS4 esram couldn't help.
If we don't see the power gap differences its because of parity that ugly P word.
If we don't see differences Pro vs Scorpio its PARITY.
When that P word isn't happening we will 900p vs 1080p type differences with Pro and Scorpio.
Ready for the kicker? The new 720p is 1080p on the Pro.
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I'm having fun as always.

I get what you're saying, but the ps4's gpu can be attributed to those differences.

Do you know of any developer that would say the ps4 pro and Scorpio are similar in terms of RAM performance? Because I know of programmers that speak of ps4/xb1 like this, ps4 has the advantage, but its not that simple. You never hear this type of talk about Scorpio/ps4, the bandwidth and cache is just a massive, obvious gap.
 
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